Michigan Rotary Club

Generation Specific => 2nd Generation Specific => 2nd Generation Build Thread => : murz April 21, 2014, 09:36:41 AM

: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz April 21, 2014, 09:36:41 AM
Hey guys, so it's rx7 rebuild season for me!

Can't wait to get it on road, gathering tools and equipment right now. Anyways, i started a thread on rx7club, feel free to check it out! Plan is to have it operational before the dream cruise, of course the sooner the better. I think this is reasonable, even for a novice haha. Hope everyone has been doing alright! http://m.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=1062009&styleid=20 (http://m.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=1062009&styleid=20)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 April 22, 2014, 12:52:04 PM
what part of Michigan are you at/near?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz April 22, 2014, 02:07:47 PM
Troy, 15 & Livernois . How about you?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 April 23, 2014, 08:54:06 AM
12 and rochester in Royal Oak lol.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz April 23, 2014, 09:02:45 AM
Oh wow, practically neighbors. You don't drive a white fc do you?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 April 23, 2014, 11:50:05 AM
All beat up with the stickers and S5 tails. Yup thats me
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz April 23, 2014, 01:24:15 PM
Oh nice, yeah I've seen ya then. Didn't look beat up to me though. How often do you ride in it?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz May 06, 2014, 12:36:14 PM
Engine is nearly ready to be pulled, pulling out the engine harness wire sucked the most so far. Rear oil line and the transmission is next. Thinking about raising the HP to 200, while keeping it NA. Any recommendations throw em' at me. (http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/may6_zps6a7f7447.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/may6_zps6a7f7447.jpg.html)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman May 07, 2014, 06:52:41 AM
If I were to build an NA without any additional porting, I would:

- Get some long divided headers that combine pretty far down the length of the car - I'd aim for at least 3 ft of primary runner length, if not more, to keep the exhaust pulses from interfering with each other.  This depends on what you want to do for emissions & muffling, but I'd recommend keeping at least 1 high-flow cat at a minimum to take care of most of the gas fumes, and if you're NA, you'll absolutely need some mufflers
- Keep the 6-port actuators working, maybe get those little inserts for the bottoms of them (although I don't remember if anyone has shown a dyno benefit to them, so maybe not)
- An actual cold-air intake, not just that K&N filter.  This would mean either building a sealed airbox around it in the engine bay with cool air fed to it from in front of the radiator, or placing the air filter in the pocket in front of the car before the radiator & routing the intake tubing to it.
- Port-matching the intake manifold at each of the splits for gaskets - anything to help the air get into the engine
- Piggyback engine management system to take out some of the excess fuel that is in the stock tune.  Mazda tuned them pretty rich, and you can safely make them a bit leaner (still 13 - 13.5:1 AFR at WOT) & gain a bit of power & efficiency.  As long as you still have the stock AFM & injectors (which you shouldn't need to change), the stock ECU should be able to handle all the above mods with just some fine-tuning needed from the piggyback.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 May 07, 2014, 09:08:28 AM
  
Oh nice, yeah I've seen ya then. Didn't look beat up to me though. How often do you ride in it?

Not as often as I should. Got to do some repairs to make it roadworthy again, runs fine just down on power.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz May 07, 2014, 09:58:09 AM
Thanks for the response!
-Long divided headers, can they be bought, or will they have to be custom fabricated? When I bought the car years ago it came with a RB header that i'll be installing as well, but now i'm intrigued about this other option.
-I have two Borla mufflers currently, they sound amazing and look great. Not sure if I even have a cat currently.
-Yeah, the 6 port thing is something I don't quite understand, I didn't have an airpump installed to begin with.
-I think the cold air-intake mod won't be too difficult, I've seen plenty of examples on the forums anyways.
-I do plan on getting a street port, size I'm not too sure yet. So just port-match the lower intake manifold to the engine ports?
-Okay, this 'piggyback' thing sounds very interesting, is it an easy install?  Is "The GReddy e-Manage" what you're describing? Link for it below.
http://rx7.com/store/rx7/fcecu.html (http://rx7.com/store/rx7/fcecu.html)

What are you doing repair-wise fidelity101? If you ever need an extra hand let me know, I'd love to learn something new haha.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 May 07, 2014, 11:25:07 AM
front wheel bearings and rear brake calipers, nothing fancy. :)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman May 08, 2014, 07:18:54 AM
  
Thanks for the response!
-Long divided headers, can they be bought, or will they have to be custom fabricated? When I bought the car years ago it came with a RB header that i'll be installing as well, but now i'm intrigued about this other option.

Yea, I was thinking of the RB headers, or something similar.  They have one header that's collected before the flange to their resonator, and one that stays separate for a lot longer.  I'm not too familiar with other vendors making NA stuff (or aftermarket parts for the FC in general), the 7club is probably a better place to research that.
-I have two Borla mufflers currently, they sound amazing and look great. Not sure if I even have a cat currently.

If you like the sound, then keep them.  A high-flow cat won't help or significantly hurt power, especially on an NA, but it will make the car smell a lot better when cold-starting, idling etc.
-Yeah, the 6 port thing is something I don't quite understand, I didn't have an airpump installed to begin with.

It looks like the engine & everything is S4, so the 6 port actuators are driven off of exhaust backpressure, not the airpump.  If you don't have a cat & already have very little backpressure, than you may not be opening them at all.  A good way to check is to do the "grease test", which I have just shamelessly stolen from the 7club:
"Grease test: Apply generous amount of grease to the base of the actuator rod, where the rod meets the actuator body (s4's rod gets pushed INTO the actuator to open the port). Drive the car around spiritedly, making sure to go past 5k rpm. Go back home, check the actuator.

On properly working actuators, the grease will get smeared all over the actuator rod when it gets pushed into the actuator body as it opens up your ports. If not working, grease will only remain where you applied it."

To get them working if you don't have backpressure or air pressure, there are other ways:
http://www.rotaryresurrection.com/rotary%20pages/electric%206%20ports_files/elec6port.html (http://www.rotaryresurrection.com/rotary%20pages/electric%206%20ports_files/elec6port.html) - describes using an electric air pump that you switch on to do it, although I think probably just replacing the actuators with solenoids would be cleaner.  You may need to worry about melting the solenoids with the exhaust depending on where you place them tho.


-I do plan on getting a street port, size I'm not too sure yet. So just port-match the lower intake manifold to the engine ports?

I was talking about LIM to UIM etc, just to make sure that when you bolt everything together there isn't a mis-match at the flanges.  You don't really want to increase the diameter of any of the runners, just make sure that the flow has a smooth path and won't get tripped up by anything.

-Okay, this 'piggyback' thing sounds very interesting, is it an easy install?  Is "The GReddy e-Manage" what you're describing? Link for it below.
[url]http://rx7.com/store/rx7/fcecu.html[/url] ([url]http://rx7.com/store/rx7/fcecu.html[/url])

Yea, the GReddy e-manage & apexi SAFC are piggyback ECUs, designed to basically just tweak the incoming airflow signal that the stock ECU receives, making the stock ECU think that you have more or less airflow than it would otherwise sense.  Therefore, the stock ECU tells the injectors to spray more or less fuel than they otherwise would, giving you some tune-able control over fuel while retaining all the maps, closed-loop control etc of the stock ECU.  You may want to look at whether you can get a system that has its own programmable outputs too, which you could use for switching the 6-port actuators.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz May 13, 2014, 12:01:07 PM
Thanks ToplessFc3sman, this is alot of great information! I'll have to test out the actuators once I get it running, testing them sounds simple. I will eventually grab one of those piggy back units as well, after I get it running of course.

 I finally pulled the engine today, didn't really put up a fight. I eventually bought a 1 ton hoist from harbor freight for $99, brand new. Had to approach the engine from the side of the car though, which worked fine. Noticed I had a broken engine mount and a strange wire that was pinched in between the engine and transmission. Decided to purchase new upgraded mounts while I'm at it, and a new stage 1 clutch from racing beat. Deciding on lightwheel steel or aluminum flywheel now, I want to maintain driveability, and I've read that the aluminum flywheel somehow impacts driveability. Anyways, soon I'll be busting her open!

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_0942_zpsd85503bb.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_0942_zpsd85503bb.jpg.html)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz May 27, 2014, 01:00:06 PM
Finally got it pulled apart, have to admit, feels pretty cool having done this. No power tools and no help haha. Really not so bad. Everything for the most part looks good though. I'm sure a lot of the seals won't need to be replaced, apex seals for sure though. So, I see that rebuild kits go for around $1,500. I think all I need will be the gasket set and apex seals.

  Think I've made my mind up on the flywheel, the lightweight steel one sounds like a good choice without being too ridiculous for street driving. Now, time to get a street port!

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_0971_zps81b52d0f.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_0971_zps81b52d0f.jpg.html)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz May 29, 2014, 12:30:43 PM
So... some good news and bad news. Took my irons and housings to Chip's motorsports to get street ported. He noticed my rotor housings were pretty bad, the sides of them were warped to the point of it being very noticeable. So time to buy some new housings, he recommended that I buy the TII housings, looks like I'll just have to plug a coolant hole and that's it. I'm wondering, if the front and rear housings are any different? On Atkins, the rear is worth about 75$ LESS than the front housings... there has to be a reason. Any idea?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman June 08, 2014, 08:12:11 AM
I think you can use rear housings for both - if I remember correctly only the rear has the hole for coolant, while the front is blocked off.  My engine was built about 8 years ago with the cooling passages in both front & rear, implying rear housings were used in both places.

(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-sXD7mwo0lPI/UarWEfcTxZI/AAAAAAAABTY/GwFc6XIiXGk/w611-h458-no/2013-06-01+11.07.14.jpg)
They're the holes above the exhaust ports & studs - one has a freeze plug installed in that pic, the other doesnt.  It turns out that the freeze plugs weren't really holding pressure tho, so maybe one of the rubber-bushing-clamped-by-a-bolt ones would be better in the future.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz June 08, 2014, 10:31:49 AM
You're right, it states this on their website as well, I just never noticed it haha, thanks! The freeze plug doesn't work for blocking them off then, gotcha. "rubber-bushing-clamped-by-a-bolt ones" huh?? Not sure what that is.

: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman June 08, 2014, 07:11:46 PM
The plug I was referring to is like this:

http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/MTM0/10227/N0290.oap?ck=Search_N0290_-1_3319&pt=N0290&ppt=C0142 (http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/detail/MTM0/10227/N0290.oap?ck=Search_N0290_-1_3319&pt=N0290&ppt=C0142)

Basically a rubber cylinder with a bolt running through the middle, washers on either end, and when you tighten down the bolt, it bulges the rubber cylinder outwards to seal up inside the hole.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz June 09, 2014, 08:55:14 AM
Ah ha! Thank you! Never knew such a thing existed, looks like I'll be getting 2 of them! Thanks again.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz June 09, 2014, 12:25:09 PM
So, been busy with finals and what not, 2 weeks of summer break for me now, yay! Have my irons getting street-ported by Chips-Motorsports, which is conveniently located nearby. Bad news is that my housings are trash, the sides of them are badly worn and overall they're badly warped. Perhaps this is due to a faulty OMP? Either way, pre-mix it will be from now on! The seals don't look bad, but I haven't gave them a closer inspection, will definitely be replacing the Apex seals and gaskets either way...

Ordered new Turbo II housings (Figured the Turbo sleeves are better) from Atkins, since I won't be using the Airpump and a few other Emissions, I ordered X 2 of the rear housings, they're significantly cheaper anyways. They do have a coolant hole that will need to be filled up though. I plan on using a rubber-expansion-plug-thing on these, which was recommended by toplessFC3Sman, Thanks again man, I had no idea this thing existed.

Right now as it stands, I'll be purchasing a lightweight steel flywheel... But there's still time to convince me to go Aluminum! I have a brand new Exedy Stage 1 clutch as well that will be going in. Soon will get the Injectors cleaned, Kinsler Fuel Injection is right down the road from me, how nice? Thinking of a Wide Band O2 sensor with the No weld strap-on-thing from Atkins, as the O2 sensor hole is too far back on the Header making the O2 wire not able to reach to the Engine harness plug. AEM No Weld Oxygen Sensor Mount (30-2355-350) (That).

Anyways, just been cleaning all the parts for now, have a pile of used brake cleaner cans already!

I'm setting my deadline for this project August 16th 2014, which is the Michigan Woodward Dream cruise, (The Woodward Dream Cruise) I've always wanted to drive in the cruise with my own vehicle that's deserving of it. That gives me about 67 days from this post! I've gone to it almost annually, minus the the past 4 years (Military)... Never once had a vehicle worthy of showing off, except an old 73 Super Beetle that I gave up on.

Here she is right now, pretty isn't she?
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1026_zps77f7d104.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1026_zps77f7d104.jpg.html)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 June 09, 2014, 09:00:41 PM
Let me know when you want to assemble it ill bring the engine stand
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz June 10, 2014, 11:49:36 AM
Awesome, I'll supply the beer then! Parts won't be in until next week, however next week I'll be in Traverse City for a week. So I'd say about 2 weeks from today. Thanks, I have an engine stand, just no adapter, I had to Jimmy-rig it when I disassembled it.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz June 12, 2014, 08:38:27 AM
Bad news, either my clutch master cyclinder or slave cylinder went out on me yesterday with my daily driver, and well I had a week long vacation to Traverse city Michigan planned... ouch! I guess at least it didn't happen on my way there?

The good news is, I sent out my Injectors to Kinsler yesterday (Literally right before my car went) and I received my Irons back from Chips-Motorsports, and damn do they look awesome! Hopefully I can pick up my injectors later (On my 2 wheeled 18-speed wal-mart special), I should have taken a picture of them beforehand, they were nasty.

I believe these are a custom template, i'd say they're mild to large, while remaining street-able. It's hard to notice a large difference until you compare previous pictures to these and then it's quite evident haha. Can't wait to put it all together, everything else should get in mid next week, so in about 2 weeks time I should be complete with the engine assembly (hopefully).

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1038_zps295237d9.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1038_zps295237d9.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1035_zps4b970764.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1035_zps4b970764.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1034_zps54f68a24.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1034_zps54f68a24.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1032_zps333aa497.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1032_zps333aa497.jpg.html)

My question is now, should I keep the stock six port sleeves or should I order the pineapple racing sleeves?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: ~Groll69~ June 12, 2014, 09:19:10 AM
The pineapple ones just have a beveled inset, that allows the air to curve into the air chamber better.  I have a set.  I do plan on using them when i get back to re-assembling my engine.

My biggest issue is needing to design and implemet a solenoid setup to open the 6 ports.  I will have lost the back pressure connection that was on the exhuast that would open them.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz June 13, 2014, 09:06:02 AM
I actually like the Atkins design better, they're a 1 piece sleeve, instead of having to glue or weld the pineapple racing inserts. https://atkinsrotary.com/store/84-92-Rx7-Atkins-Designed-Six-Port-Actuator-Valve-Kit-ARE113.html

I'd be afraid of the tiny inserts coming undone and ruining the engine. I might just get those ^. Since the Aux ports are ported now though, think I should port out the sleeves a little? I'm just firing from the hip, not sure if that matters or not. Anyways, still going to Traverse City, just won't be taking my own car haha.

Once I get the car running, the next step will be suspension I think, it seemed fine before, but I'm sure it's the original stock suspension, doomed to fail at some point soon. I have yet to really look at that anyways.

My car has an aftermarket pre-silencer that actually has a back pressure tube for the 5th and 6th ports, pretty cool! Really hope they work though, think i'll test them with my air compressor somehow and vaseline previously mentioned.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman June 13, 2014, 09:29:58 AM
Be careful porting the sleeves, you still need them to close at the same time to get the low-speed benefits.  I'd assemble them in the manifold & one of the irons all bolted together and mark the open & closed positions on the sleeve through the iron's port.  Then take it apart & look at whether you'd gain much area by doing it.  My impression is that you won't, since you want a little bit of extra material (2-3mm ish) on the opening side to make sure its closed & can't flow at low speeds, and there's no point in porting the closing side if that side of the sleeve is still in the iron & not facing the port.  The primary benefit of the port is that you have a later port closing time, not that it gives you a greater flow area (although that does help at high speeds), so porting the sleeve but risking that it won't function anymore IMO isn't worth it.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz June 19, 2014, 01:36:57 PM
Thanks ToplessFc3Sman, totally makes sense now, I won't be messing with them.

Little back story here, back in high school, one of my best friends had a 1987 SE Tornado silver Rx-7 with a street port, his dad re-did the whole car from a rolling chassis with no engine, he owned a body shop, so I guess that made it easier. Anyways, it ended up being beautiful (I would saw flawless), then he sold it for $8k to some guy who was buying it for his kid's graduation. I really missed driving around in the car, and just plain seeing it. Thus my passion for the Rx-7 was born! It didn't help living in Japan for 2 years seeing Rx-7s everywhere all the time. So I had always wanted one! I bought one the 2nd week I came home from Japan, few years later here I am!

Anyways... got my DD fixed, ended up being a shot Master and Slave cylinder, got it fixed an hour before I left for vacation, for a lot less than I was expecting as well.

Got back from Vacation and I had some parts waiting for me! Two S4 TII housings, gasket kit, apex seals, various bolts that needed to be replaced, a dvd, engine mounts, and a stage 1 Exedy clutch kit that I forgot to take a picture of. I got these all from Atkins or Racing Beat.
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1092_zps55392353.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1092_zps55392353.jpg.html)
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1091_zpsab7756e9.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1091_zpsab7756e9.jpg.html)
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1090_zps84920355.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1090_zps84920355.jpg.html)
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1089_zpse8b54485.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1089_zpse8b54485.jpg.html)

Also, for the coolant passages in the rotor housings, I have a set of expansion plugs (19mm-22mm) I picked up from the auto parts store, they're sitting in the holes currently.

Decided to test out the auxiliary port actuators, I shot compressed air into the vacuum hose, and noticed only one pump working. Took off the other, and it was stuck open! I sprayed WD40 into it many times, and it wouldn't budge. Eventually, after knocking it a bit with a hammer and just pulling on it, it came loose. Threw it back on there, tightened it up real good, and it works like a charm now!

So, the rebuild should commence soon, let me know if anyone would like to help out!  8)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 June 20, 2014, 05:16:18 AM
Yeah let me know when/what date you plan on assembly, I like having more practice. I will be rebuilding another engine (this time for myself) so the more the merrier!

I'm hoping that after I move I can setup a good rotary workshop and crank out a few engines a year.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz June 23, 2014, 08:28:49 PM
I'm thinking this Friday or anytime this weekend, I have class mid week now.

Vacation was great, I'd say I needed it, but I'm getting paid to go to college full time, so not really haha! Anyways, got home and painted some things here and there, got my Injectors back. Apparently they were pretty bad, a-lot needed replacing with them, but they run great (48-49 Lb/hr), one of them runs 6% better than the others at 51 lb/hr for some reason. Think I'll paint these too, while I'm on a painting spree.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1103_zps7fa6229f.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1103_zps7fa6229f.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1111_zpsaf970fb9.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1111_zpsaf970fb9.jpg.html)

So, hopefully this Friday or Saturday I begin re-assembly! if anyone wants to help out, let me know, I'll supply beer haha!
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz June 23, 2014, 08:49:10 PM
Oh, and if you noticed I deleted the Fuel pulsation dampener on the primary fuel rail, I used a banjo bolt and 2 new washers. 
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 June 24, 2014, 05:09:33 AM
bad weekend for me I am moving to my new place in waterford. or at least starting to move.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz June 25, 2014, 01:32:28 PM
Aw man, that's a bummer, hopefully it all goes well for you! That's the area I want to live eventually. The rotary workshop idea sounds awesome! Never thought I'd have so much fun with this project. Anyways if you get down time and have nothing else to do, let me know.

Finally, the last shipment of parts came in! Racing beat lightweight steel flywheel, rear counter weight, Atkins aux intake sleeves and a few other things.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1114_zps3b6d99e2.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1114_zps3b6d99e2.jpg.html)

The sleeves look really good, well polished throughout, much better than the stock 90 degree bend!

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1115_zps5217641a.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1115_zps5217641a.jpg.html)

This Friday I begin re-assembly, hopefully...
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz June 27, 2014, 10:26:08 AM
So, I realized, last moment I should have ordered new corner seal springs, the ones I had were the original wire ones, oops. So next week re-assembly will begin! Anyways, in the mean time I decided to paint some things, including the block here's how it looks, as well as my injectors. (http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1128_zps29992157.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1128_zps29992157.jpg.html) I was going to paint the housings as well, but I really dig this look now. What do you guys think?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz July 06, 2014, 03:47:34 PM
So, i managed to get the major engine assembly finished. It wasn't too bad, I followed Atkin's rebuild dvd and followed along the haynes manual. The most difficult part was getting the second rotor into the housing, matching up with the Eccentric shaft without dropping any of the rotor seals, a rubber band did help. I used petroleum jelly to support the water seals, not too much of it was needed really. I realized after the fact that I should have used hylomar, as PJ would cause the seals to swell. How ever, I called Atkins and they reassured me i'd be fine, as long as I don't take her apart anytime soon. Phew! Oh, front and main seal were replaced as well.

Anyways, it wasn't bad really, coming from someone that has pretty much no experience with this sort of thing. Took 2 hours total. No help, no power tools, just a torque wrench and basic tools. Definitely a confidence booster when it comes to the automotive repair world.

I haven't yet assembled the front cover yet, because I don't have a dial indicator to measure end play, tomorrow I'll swing by and grab one from harbor freight hopefully.  (I'm sure endplay won't really change, but I'd rather be safe.)


(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1146_zpsd70dd89a.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1146_zpsd70dd89a.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1147_zps5c0d86f8.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1147_zps5c0d86f8.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1148_zpse3be3da8.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1148_zpse3be3da8.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1149_zps220e9e99.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1149_zps220e9e99.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1150_zps37b65d00.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1150_zps37b65d00.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1151_zps9a5aa3b0.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1151_zps9a5aa3b0.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1152_zpsd3ec766a.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1152_zpsd3ec766a.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1153_zps0321f6b7.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1153_zps0321f6b7.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1154_zps6cccd412.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1154_zps6cccd412.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1155_zps7fe8c343.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1155_zps7fe8c343.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1156_zps4bbac071.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1156_zps4bbac071.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1157_zpsea810a32.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1157_zpsea810a32.jpg.html)

Anyways, hope everyone has had a great 4th of July weekend! Murica! It would be AWESOME if I was able to get this car up and going this week!
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz July 06, 2014, 03:49:10 PM
Here's one last picture, I've read that re-aligning the engine to the transmission isn't fun. Any tips or tricks? Also, replacing the Throw out bearing and seal, thermal pellet, front main bolt and more.
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/2_zps63cea1e8.png) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/2_zps63cea1e8.png.html)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 July 07, 2014, 05:58:06 AM
it just takes a whole lot of shaking and pry bar from the steering rack to the front cover.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: ~Groll69~ July 07, 2014, 07:58:33 AM
looking great.  Wanna rebuild mine now?  lol
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz July 07, 2014, 08:35:45 AM
Thanks haha, it wasn't that bad, especially coming from me! But I'd be glad to help for sure!  :) 

Well looks like today I'll finish the assembly of the short block, have a lightweight steel flywheel, stage 1 clutch kit and new bearings to get thrown on! This car is going to be a blast to drive hehe. Hopefully I can manage getting the engine in today as well, that would be fantastic! I have the entire day off to dick around with this, weather dependent of course. Thanks for the confidence with this guys!
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman July 08, 2014, 12:06:14 PM
Wow, it's looking good!  I can't wait to see it on the road!
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz July 10, 2014, 03:03:03 PM
Thanks! Same here, hope to have it running soon. Since I'll be pre-mixing... I'll have to start gathering some 2 stroke oil. So far, I've read that a good option is Red Line 2 stroke oil and mix it 5.5oz to 5 gallons of fuel. Also, what Octane fuel should I use then? 
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman July 11, 2014, 06:06:38 PM
If you're still NA and haven't changed the compression ratio or advanced the spark much, 87 should be fine.  The extra knock protection won't do you any good if you don't knock on 87
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz July 14, 2014, 09:12:43 PM
  So, I've slowed down progress a bit. Full time college takes a bit out of my free time. Also, rebuilding a rotary engine is a lot to take in, especially for someone with my basically zero previous automotive maintenance experience. Though, I can't tell you how many hours have been spent reading build threads, looking up how-to's, double checking what it is that I'm even doing, the forums have been my home as of lately, as well as the Haynes manual.

  So, as of now, I have 32 days left until I reach my deadline of having this build complete (as in running, reliable etc.). I'm pretty confident I'll reach my goal, how ever, it would be nice to have it running by this upcoming weekend as the 26 and 27th I'll be up in Icecoda Michigan (Oscoda, oops), and it will make the perfect opportunity to break in my engine. So... I'm going to try for that! Even if I don't make my goal, then I'll still continue to work on it. After I meet my goal, I think the next thing to do is upgrade suspension, then body work stuff, I need a new front fender badly, I absolutely hate the one I have on right now, it's also cracked... I found this image on facebook, I think I'm going to try and aim for getting my car to look similar to this one, while staying NA, minus painting the spoiler silver and T2 hood, I think my tint is darker also. I wonder what the wheel and tire specs are though?

 (http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1186_zpsb82059a2.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1186_zpsb82059a2.jpg.html)

Anyways, after the major assembly was done I took a bit of a break. Finally got off my ass and got to work. This is how I was able to torque the flywheel and front hub assembly. Using an engine stand arm as a stopper, saved me from buying an actual flywheel stopper. Notice the new flywheel? Lightweight Steel Racing beat, with the appropriate counterweight as well.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1162_zpscc97f53b.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1162_zpscc97f53b.jpg.html)

Next step was to assembly the front stack and measure end play, I was getting 0.0025 in' until I properly torqued the flywheel then I got 0.002. According to the manual, it was in specifications, so I went with it.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1165_zps727aecf3.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1165_zps727aecf3.jpg.html)
New clutch!
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1189_zpsf867faa3.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1189_zpsf867faa3.jpg.html)
New Pressure plate!
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1194_zps6bb1d009.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1194_zps6bb1d009.jpg.html)

Notice the pulley? Yeah... as an early birthday present I got myself a glimer pulley set. I've read that fabrication had to be done about 50% of the time. Yeah... I had to fabricate the water pump pulley, just used a stone drill grinder bit thing, and walah, it fit! Assembled the front cover, using a gasket and RTV. Then threw the oil pan on, just using RTV great stuff without the gasket, which is something I read on the forums as well. Transferred timing marks over, and set the CAS properly. Turned the engine, and heard the whooosh noises! I'd be lying if I said that didn't excite me. Threw the power steering pulley on and called it a day, the water pump housing is just on it for looks right now... been to lazy to actually seal it down for some reason. Anyways, it looks good, at least to me it does. Also have my new motor mounts as well, my old ones were bad, one snapped in half, and the other is about to.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1207_zps1c90b87f.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1207_zps1c90b87f.jpg.html)

Forgot to mention, replaced the pilot bearing and seal, throw out bearing, front pulley bolt, and a new thermal pellet from Atkins rotary. There's probably more that I can't remember right now.

Here's a picture of block off plates, OMP and ACV, as well as my painted 5th and 6th port actuators. The LIM is bolted and sealed down, I actually almost forgot to add the sleeves! That could have been bad...

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1203_zps756c1524.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1203_zps756c1524.jpg.html)

It's ready to get installed into the bay really, I want to install the rest (rat's nest, fuel rails, hoses, etc.) once it's in. One thing that's hanging me up a bit is the old previous exhaust pipe from manifold to pre-silencer has 2 nuts that are rusted pretty damn good, I don't have enough anger built up in me to get it, and I've tried everything but heat. I'll have to borrow a neighbor's propane torch I think.

So, from researching pre-mixing, I think it's safe to say I'll be mixing 100:1 TC-W3 2 stroke oil, or one 16oz per tank using 87 octane. Now to find out what type of engine oil to use, so many options. 20w50 perhaps?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz July 22, 2014, 10:32:34 AM
So, I got the engine installed on the 17th, and on the 18th at midnight the car was 98% complete. I had some assistance from my neighbor who helped me raise and lower the engine hoist as I was wrestling the engine into place on the input shaft, this took a few hours, eventually it slid right into place.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1219_zpse432a5d1.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1219_zpse432a5d1.jpg.html)

 I got the engine in at 4:50, and I had to be on the road by 5:30 for class. So the next day I resumed my work and completed everything except the alternator, which I had to replace the pulley, and charge the battery.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1223_zpsc3e56e59.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1223_zpsc3e56e59.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1224_zps2588178a.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1224_zps2588178a.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1227_zps3ef21a94.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1227_zps3ef21a94.jpg.html)
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1230_zps0201bd6b.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1230_zps0201bd6b.jpg.html)

So, woke up the next morning quite early, bought all necessary fluids, got a neighbor to use an impact hammer to replace my pulley, took like 2 seconds. Threw the alternator in, plugged it in and installed the belt. Topped off the oil, the coolant, power-steering and mixed a 5 gallon contain with 87 octane and 2 stroke oil, I added 7 ounces of 2 stroke to 5 gallons of gas, I went with a little extra oil to be safe. I noticed it only took about 3 quarts of coolant before it topped off. Installed the battery and primed it up by removing the fuse and cranking it. Threw the fuse back in, and crossed my fingers and decided to try and start it.

It started up on the first try! I shut her down because she revved to 3k, and then climbed to 4k, freaked me out a bit. Also, after watching the video I realized I forgot to tighten the power-steering bi-pulley. The coolant cap was off due to me still trying to fill it up.
http://youtu.be/P7DyuG0AsPM (http://youtu.be/P7DyuG0AsPM)

Tried to start her again, and she didn't want to start, figured I flooded her... So I de-flooded it and she started up again, same thing... revved to 3k then climbed to 4k. At the point I realized I should just let her run! First, I decided to take off the TB and re-tighten it and make sure there were no leaks. also took off the cruise control. Started her up again, and now a different issue. Bouncing Idle... I assume it's the TPS (which forum members helped fortify my belief), which isn't a tough fix, how ever It's going to be tough to get it warmed up without actually driving her.

http://youtu.be/01nj4v0BbFE (http://youtu.be/01nj4v0BbFE)

Total run time so far, probably about 40 minutes.

Finally got my RX7 Decal on her!
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1249_zps6ac8979c.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1249_zps6ac8979c.jpg.html)

Anyways, I was able to at least build an engine and get her started. That's a pretty awesome feeling.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz July 23, 2014, 04:42:07 PM
Went to adjust the TPS today, was hoping to ride up to class haha, nope... my multimeter is dead.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: FCwidman July 26, 2014, 01:30:55 PM
great build! makes me even more excited to do mine. Get it running good yet? I wanna hear what it sounds like
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz July 29, 2014, 10:04:00 AM
Thanks! Haven't got around to messing with it, found out my multimeter had a blown fuse, haven't been in a hurry really to get it running right. I'm over the hump and all that's left is simple stuff, hopefully. Been out of town this weekend, but Friday look what I bought! The price i got for this was a steal, it runs nicely too! Just needs new brake lines.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1269_zps659a26ea.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1269_zps659a26ea.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1280_zps12a9ef7a.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1280_zps12a9ef7a.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1278_zpsd6584dcd.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1278_zpsd6584dcd.jpg.html)

It's a 91, bone stock really, with 100300 miles on it. There's some surface rust, but for the most part it's in great shape. She's so quiet compared to my 86. She drives great, minus the fact that brakes don't work...
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: ~Groll69~ July 29, 2014, 12:03:40 PM
Bone Stock is getting to be a rarity.  Keep it nice.  I see you got the BBS wheels on both cars.  our vert never had them.  We had some crappy after markets which we got rid of quickly. 
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz July 29, 2014, 12:34:14 PM
Thanks, I'm all for keeping it bone stock as well, it runs really nice and sounds beautiful running! The old air filter had a mouse living in it haha. The headlights didn't work once randomly, and the tach didn't work once either. All very weird, leads me to suspect there's a grounding issue. I really dig the 9k rev limit! Oh, and i believe the 5th and 6th port actuators are stuck too. Anyways, brakes and a tune up this week and I think it will be good. It idles at 700rpms very steady! You wouldn't even know it's running until you give it gas.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: ITSWILL July 31, 2014, 07:31:10 PM
Cool man, I can't wait to see one of these!  It seems like I always have at least two of them for some reason too. But it also seems I never have 2 good running cars at the same time!
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz September 23, 2014, 11:42:14 AM
So, the goal was to get her running for the Dream Cruise, which would have been completely attainable, if it wasn't for this Annoying "Newer" Rx7 that took up my time! Did the TB mod outlined here by Fidelity101 http://www.rx7club.com/rotary-car-performance-77/throttle-body-mod-thread-airflow-data-702539/ (http://www.rx7club.com/rotary-car-performance-77/throttle-body-mod-thread-airflow-data-702539/) (thanks by the way!) and that's about it... I haven't even thrown it back on the car yet... I did paint it though! The plan is to get her running this week sometime or this weekend. I want to enjoy her while I can because... I've been convinced to go the turbo route. I would love to keep the original engine and just make a 6 port turbo, but cost wise it seems cheaper to just swap in a whole Turbo II engine with transmission and all. I'll find something for this engine later on. So with that being said, things I'll be needing.
-T2 engine with transmission and wiring harness. (Will go megasquirt eventually)
-T2 hood
-T2 Differential & Driveshaft
-T2 exhaust
-New Radiator down the road.
-I don't think I'll need a Fuel pump upgrade, or will I?
Anyways, thought I'd update this thread so there it is.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 September 23, 2014, 12:52:55 PM
its was easier to just put a t2 in it. also replace the fuel pump, they are 20+ years old and terrible. a walbro low flow 255 works great.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman September 23, 2014, 07:43:49 PM
Yea, the walbro 255 lph pump is enough to keep up with the turbo engine.  I'm still running the one I put in when originally doing the turbo swap, even tho I'm running bigger injectors and more boost on the BNR stage 2 turbo, and the pump is keeping up just fine.

If I were to do it again, I would:


Also, if you're going to be doing it, I'd get the differential & half-shafts from an S4 - generally people like the clutch-type LSD better than the viscous type, plus the torsen LSD from an FD just drops in with the S4 half-shafts (but not with S5).

You can either go with the T2 hood or with a front-mount IC - they both have their drawbacks.  The top-mount IC with the T2 hood tends to heat-soak much more readily and doesn't get as much airflow as a front-mount, so it can't cool the charge as much, BUT it is much less volume that the turbo needs to compress air into, so boost response is better and its more compact.

I've been using the racing beat cat-back system that I originally got when my 'vert was NA, and then a collection of test-pipes to connect to the stock downpipe, so you shouldn't have to replace the whole exhaust system if you don't want to.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 September 24, 2014, 06:21:07 AM
I run one in my NA carb, its just cheaper and better than a used/new stock one. EVERY used stock one is on its way out I feel by now. Lots of them are SUPER noisy/angry sounding. Its just not worth the hassle because a 2nd hand one will be replaced soon or is already not up to spec anymore.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz September 27, 2014, 06:09:44 PM
Thanks guys! Yeah i'll probably throwing in a complete t2 engine with trans. Any pros to a jdm spec? I'll be taking out the rebuilt engine, maybe make something out of it, like a bridge ported six port turbo. Who knows! So the only part i might have difficulty getting is the t2 differential. I'll probably run it stock for a bit then start the upgrades, but it will be ran with a rb downpipe either way and keep the current exhaust system presilencer back. Yeah i plan on getting a new megasquirt rather than a used one.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz September 27, 2014, 06:13:17 PM
Sorry, didn't notice but, How much $ are the fuel pumps running? Have a link?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman September 28, 2014, 10:01:49 PM
If you want to use the NA diff with the turbo trans, you'll need a custom driveshaft to hold you over until you go with a turbo rear end.

IIRC, the pumps were about $100 or so for the whole kit
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz September 29, 2014, 07:38:25 AM
Wow i have no reason not to get that kit then! I kinda like the LSD diff i have on it currently. What's the pros to going turbo diff? They're both 4.1's? Or is it just stronger and made for higher power?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 September 29, 2014, 07:51:42 AM
they are both 4.10s but the t2 diff has larger axles, thicker driveshaft and 8" ring gear compared to NAs 7"
: Turbo GXL
: murz October 06, 2014, 04:44:07 PM
So, I acquired an S4 Turbo Limited Slip differential that will be going into the "Turbo GXL", with that being said I'll still need axles, which isn't all that difficult to find, worse case scenario being Autozone, I can't believe they actually sell them! Thanks Will.

I haven't mentioned this yet, but the engine I'm most likely going to grab is an S5 JDM Turbo engine...  it comes with the transmission, ecu & harness, powersteering, a/c etc.

However, it doesn't look like it will come with a mass air flow sensor or throttle cable. I do have an S5 NA mass air flow sensor, but I read it can run on one, but will run rich with that instead of the turbo MAF. However, seems like autozone has the turbo MAF (http://www.autozone.com/autozone/parts/1990-Mazda-RX7/Mass-Air-Flow-Sensor/_/N-igu6lZ9gsmv (http://www.autozone.com/autozone/parts/1990-Mazda-RX7/Mass-Air-Flow-Sensor/_/N-igu6lZ9gsmv)) just in case. It's got me thinking too, the chassis side wire harness (Alternator, starter, etc) will probably need to be S5 as well. I doubt the S4 connectors would work in this application, however if it's just something as simple as using an S4 alternator then I'm good, as I have one. I'm terrible ( as in I have no experience) at  fabricating wiring.

I plan to use the racing beat downpipe ( http://www.racingbeat.com/RX7-1986-1992/Exhaust-Down-Pipes-Presilencers/16207.html (http://www.racingbeat.com/RX7-1986-1992/Exhaust-Down-Pipes-Presilencers/16207.html)), but I'll also need to get a fuel defender (http://www.racingbeat.com/RX7-1986-1992/Electronics/11571.html (http://www.racingbeat.com/RX7-1986-1992/Electronics/11571.html)) This thing I think... This will prevent boost creep from the free flowing exhaust, thanks Topless (correct me if I'm wrong). Maybe just get bigger injectors? While I'm at it, I should install a new clutch, RB engine mounts (which I have), and a new throw out bearing.

Really wondering how different a JDM S5 engine really is, and how much of a hassle it will be installing and getting it running into an S4 chassis. I plan to get her to push 250 whp - 300 whp, more in the future for sure, but for now I think that's rather conservative while being fun and safe. Anyways thanks guys for the help and advice so far, I'm new to engine swaps and turbos in general, so this is all new to me.

Oh, and I found my first picture I took of the car back in 2012.
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/get-attachrx7mentaspx_zpsb7b098c7.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/get-attachrx7mentaspx_zpsb7b098c7.jpg.html)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman October 06, 2014, 08:21:29 PM
Sorry, I guess I wasn't clear - the fuel cut defender (FCD) won't prevent boost creep, it will just keep it from being catastrophic.  With a free-flowing exhaust, the turbo has less backpressure on it, so the turbine makes more power and thus can compress more intake air to a higher pressure.  Normally, you could open the wastegate further to bypass the turbine, but the stock S4 & S5 internal wastegates aren't big enough even when fully open to bypass enough exhaust gas around the turbine, so you get boost creep.  This wouldn't be so bad, except that when the boost gets above a pre-set limit (6 psi for S4's, maybe 9-10 psi for S5's IIRC), the stock ECU cuts fuel, which can cause a lean condition and lead to detonation, killing the engine.

All the FCD does is prevent the ECU from actually seeing the correct boost pressure, so it never detects the pressure that would cause fuel-cut.  Effectively, the FCD passes through the manifold pressure signal unchanged up to atmospheric pressure, and then starts scaling it once you're boosting. Since the actual fueling rate is based on the AFM, which detects the extra air flow that goes with the additional boost, you get enough fuel delivered by the injectors, BUT the spark correction, which is also based on the boost as well as air flow, can get too aggressive if you push the boost beyond a few PSI over stock.  Even so, I'd run 93 octane exclusively for the extra knock protection since the spark will be slightly advanced when boosting.

With that being said... $130 for one?! Holy crap, its a couple of resistors and connectors!  I used to have one, let me dig around & see if I can find it for you.

Also, DO NOT use the S5 NA AFM - it will be rich at low to mid loads, right up to the point where the turbo maxes out it's flow capacity and then you go lean, popping the engine!  For example (and i'm sure the numbers are wildly inaccurate), say the S5 NA flows 100 cubic ft of air/minute (CFM).  The ECU will want to see that whole range from 0 - 100 CFM over it's voltage scale of 0-5V, so the S5 NA AFM will show 0V at 0 CFM, and 5V at 100 CFM, at which point it is max-ed out and can't read any higher.  Now, if the S5 Turbo flows 150 CFM, then the S5 Turbo AFM will have 0V at 0 CFM but 5V at 150 CFM.  If the S5 turbo ECU is expecting to convert 5V into 150 CFM, but it's hooked up to an S5 NA ECU telling it 5V (which is actually 100 CFM), the ECU will deliver 50% more fuel than is necessary, making the engine run rich.  The dangerous part comes when the engine actually flows more air than the NA AFM can measure - at that point it just keeps reporting it's maximum airflow and the ECU doesn't add any more fuel or pull any more timing, and the engine runs lean & goes "POP".  This is a pretty simplified explanation, leaving out all the correction curves that convert between CFM and voltage, temperature correction etc, but you get the picture...

There is a bit of a difference between S4 & S5 alternator wiring, but IIRC it amounts to running 1 extra wire.  I've swapped the larger output S6 alternator into my S4 'vert, and it just needed a voltage signal wire from the fuse box next to the battery.

One thing to be cautious of with S5's is the electronically controlled OMP - if it works well, then great, but they seem to be a bit of a failure point vs. the S4's mechanical OMP.  Then again, when the S4's OMP fails, you don't necessarily see it as an OMP failure, you see it as an engine failure...
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz October 07, 2014, 08:17:05 AM
Makes complete sense now, thank you. So now my question is this, if I just port out the waste gate would that fix the issue? But I guess either way I'd need the FCD if I want to run higher than stock boost. I'm not sure how much boost is even needed to get around 250hp, but I've read that the stock turbo maxes out at 12 PSI, would a boost controller be needed to attain that level? Right now the only mods I can think of doing is just full RB exhaust, FCD, and Megasquirt eventually. I will be upgrading the fuel pump to the one you guys mentioned, the Walbro 255. Will I need a fuel pressure regulator? Yeah, I agree $130 for such a simple device is a rip off, if you could find the FCD that would awesome, thank you!

Now I understand how AFMs work, yeah crisis averted, thanks for that well put explanation.

So, I want to go premix, I just figure it to be much safer and efficient. But the S5 MOP, when removed throws an error code and puts the car into limp mode... I'll have to find a way around this.

Hmmm, so JDM engines don't come with crank angle sensors I read somewhere. Wondering if an NA S5 CAS would just drop in. I'd think so...
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman October 07, 2014, 10:20:15 AM
The stock turbo can't push more than about 10-12 psi, and even then, 12 psi doesn't make much more power than 10 since the backpressure starts going up pretty quickly due to the more restrictive turbine wheel.  From that point you can get into hybrid turbos like the BNR, and clipping the turbine wheel to make it less restrictive, but these mods start to trade off low-RPM responsiveness for high-RPM power.

The CAS should just drop in, and is the same for NA & turbo engines.  Some FC's (euro market primarily) had distributors there instead of the CAS, but I thought JDM engines had the CAS too.

As for the S5's OMP - you could potentially use the S5 engine with S4 electronics & premix, or just use the S5 OMP.  I like using the OMP because there's no chance of forgetting to add premix to the tank.

I don't know if an FPR is strictly necessary with the Walbro 255, but I had installed one and then put a gauge on the fuel pressure about 2 years later and realized that the fuel pressure was constant, not changing with intake pressure, so either the stock FPR was overwhelmed by the extra flow or it was broken.  Either way, it got replaced with an aeromotive FPR that's been working well and seems to have plenty of capacity, for relatively cheap.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz October 08, 2014, 12:31:10 PM
Hmmm, i'll have to look into hybrid turbos, I'd be cool with high RPM power haha. But i get what you're saying, I also enjoy low RPM responsiveness, especially if it's going to be a street car. Well, I have two CAS so, i'm good on that. Yeah I read somewhere JDM engines don't have CAS, you're probably right, wouldn't make much sense really.

The OMP thing I'll have to put some thought into, honestly I'd rather just premix, I'll have to figure this one out. Same for the FPR.

Anyways, tried to start her up today, dead battery unfortunately, I did get her to crank and almost start, having the huge exhaust leak with headers creates the best sound ever. Second attempt the battery was too weak. Will try again tomorrow. Would like to drive her before the swap!

Bird poop on the door, she needs a wash badly. That's the downside of sitting underneath power lines.
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1503_zpsca464ced.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1503_zpsca464ced.jpg.html)

Throttle body mod, plus paint.
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1497_zps7dded570.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1497_zps7dded570.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1505_zps7d6c0be7.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1505_zps7d6c0be7.jpg.html)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz October 10, 2014, 02:18:13 PM
Anyways, the issue I was having with the 86 was the idle was messed up. Well, to sum up what was happening, the thermowax and dash-pot were somehow jamming the throttle, keeping you from really doing anything. It was un-driveable, very un-driveable! So, Fidelity101 gave me the great idea of just simplifying the throttle body by removing those unnecessary plates and the thermowax and dash-pot. I did this, and didn't install it in the car until about a week ago. I also painted it!

And there she sat for another week. Yesterday I got the time and desire to try and start her. She wouldn't start, the battery died from too many attempts, so I put her on the charger and said I'd try tomorrow.

So, today I got the desire to give her a shot to shine. I also noticed the Mass Air Flow sensor was unplugged... probably why she wouldn't start the day before? Anyways, she fired right up, and idled right away too! i didn't expect that... Due to broken studs on the Pre-silencer, she has a giant exhaust leak. So she's louder than anything. I moved all three other vehicles out of the drive way and took her on the road. I feel like an idiot for not doing this previously, as she's an absolute thrill to drive! I'm glad I kept the actuators on, as the low end torque is veddy-nice-ah (compared to the Vert and how she ran previously)! The lightweight flywheel makes a ton of difference, she wants to move all the time, and does it noticeably faster! I'm keeping her below 4k for now, for break in purposes. At 4k RPMs she's too loud anyways. Also the Stage 1 Exedy clutch is very nice, another great mod I'd recommend!
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1507_zps7ccc1ff1.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1507_zps7ccc1ff1.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1509_zps9c7702fb.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1509_zps9c7702fb.jpg.html)

She idles at 1200 RPMs right now, I have been driving her all day and yesterday. I have the idle set kind of high for break in reasons, I adjusted the TPS correctly, and it's surging a bit when at idle, which isn't a real big issue really. So it's probably something else causing it now. She's just super loud really, I'll get around to fixing the exhaust leak next week. The electric fan switch I have broke on me while driving, so I redid it today, and replaced a few bulbs and stuff.

Everything seems to be working just fine now, you can hear the glimer belt sound on decel which sounds great. The lighter flywheel makes a big difference, better shifts and quicker accelerations, I probably could have just gone with an aluminum one really, but this one is just fine. The Stage 1 Exedy clutch kit works great with the flywheel as well, shifting is so smooth and quick now. I'd totally recommend the flywheel and stage 1 clutch kit for an NA car, I'd even go lighter too!
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 October 13, 2014, 05:30:52 AM
surging idle leads me to think bad BAC.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz October 13, 2014, 05:20:09 PM
The surging is very strange, some days it doesn't do it, some days it does. I think you're right though, because pressing the brakes, using power steering, or turning the lights on will lower the rpms and it takes a while for it to go back up. With the higher idle right now it's not really an issue. It still revs up to 3k RPMs on cold start up for a second or two, I thought the thermowax delete would prevent this? I'm not complaining though, the 3k RPM start up is fine, just strange that it's still happening. I'll have to find a way to test out the BAC, I have an S5 one, but I think they're different connectors.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman October 14, 2014, 09:41:18 AM
I've seen the BAC stick before, sometimes only in cold weather, sometimes randomly.  Make sure you have coolant plumbed through the tube connected to it so that it warms up pretty quickly.  I think the factory ECU only uses it as an on-off device, so you could potentially check it by running wires directly to it from the battery and seeing if it clicks (or if the engine speed jumps up, if the engine is running)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz October 30, 2014, 01:15:11 PM
Well, I have the surging fixed, I did the lamp method instead of ohms, replaced the Glimer belt with a dual belt that isn't underdrive. Seemed to have fixed the hesitations as well by redoing a few grounds. I got her to idle near 1200, but anything lower she will try to stall and recover, and that keeps going. So I have her idling around 1500 for now, anyways here's the video.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLXOQcAdx6c&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLXOQcAdx6c&feature=youtu.be)

I wonder if the high idle is due to the streetport, I doubt it though because the Primaries aren't that big. Anyways that's not the issue, it wants to stall when I brake or use power steering. So maybe it's the BAC?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: fidelity101 October 30, 2014, 01:42:46 PM
  
I've seen the BAC stick before, sometimes only in cold weather, sometimes randomly.  Make sure you have coolant plumbed through the tube connected to it so that it warms up pretty quickly.  I think the factory ECU only uses it as an on-off device, so you could potentially check it by running wires directly to it from the battery and seeing if it clicks (or if the engine speed jumps up, if the engine is running)

Have it idling and put your finger on it you should feel the solenoid pulsing back and forth.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz December 14, 2014, 06:03:34 PM
So, my multi meter died a while back, it was a pos any ways... So I'll finalllllly get around to testing out the BAC.

Anyways, in regards to the turbo swap, I've acquired some stuff! 1987 Turbo II complete engine with rebuilt turbo, Turbo II transmission, with light weight steel flywheel, new clutch, pressure plate and Pilot bearing, complete wiring & ECU, turbo AFM, Top mount inter-cooler, 550 Primaries, 720 Secondaries, AND an S4 Turbo LSD Differential.  Oh, the engine has 76k miles on it, but it seems to have good compression currently, (It did when taken out of the original car as well.) But I'll do a legit compression test later on of course.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1758_zpsc4e33315.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1758_zpsc4e33315.jpg.html)

So, all that's left to find is...
S4 Throttle Cable (Or just fabricate something)
S4 Turbo Boost sensor
Turbo Half Shafts
New Fuel pump, probably going to go with the Walbro 255L
Downpipe
Fuel Cut Defender thing
Turbo inlet duct
Turbo Driveshaft

Some of these things I already have lined up such as the driveshaft and maybe half shafts.

Anyways, I wanted to go Megasquirt with the NA set up, But... I think I'll just get it Turbo swapped first. Also... thinking of going front mount inter-cooler right away, so I wouldn't need a Turbo II hood. I think I have my ducks in a row... Feel free to chime in!

: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz December 14, 2014, 08:05:32 PM
Oh, I forgot to mention this old news... exhaust fixed!!! No more exhaust leak, in fact the exhaust sounds pretty damn good if you ask me. Here's a video clip.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uu0uFpiXroY&list=UUPQMAe12g925q5MgXD6j2vA&index=1 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uu0uFpiXroY&list=UUPQMAe12g925q5MgXD6j2vA&index=1)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLXOQcAdx6c&index=2&list=UUPQMAe12g925q5MgXD6j2vA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QLXOQcAdx6c&index=2&list=UUPQMAe12g925q5MgXD6j2vA)

: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: ITSWILL December 15, 2014, 06:24:36 AM
Im pretty sure I have the boost sensor,inlet duct, fuel pump and drive shaft you need.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: ~Groll69~ December 15, 2014, 07:31:07 AM
nice.  what are your plans for your rebuilt NA motor?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz December 15, 2014, 08:12:44 AM
Awesome, that's really all the hard to find parts out of the way then. Groll69, good question haha, I'm not 100% sure what I'm going to do with it, I was thinking of selling it, but I think I'm going to keep it. I have a 6 port turbo intake manifold, and might make either a 6 port turbo or better flowing NA motor for down the road. I'm not 100% sure though. (http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1760_zps261c444b.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1760_zps261c444b.jpg.html) It will probably be some sort of project.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz December 16, 2014, 02:01:14 PM
So much to consider and plan out when it comes to this build! Either way it's another learning process, and I'm not in a hurry to get this complete.

 I originally wanted to go the Megasquirt option, and did a lot of researching into it, I really like what it can do. My car is set up for low impedance (LI) injectors, and I have a pair of LI 550cc... and a pair of 750cc, but I'm not sure if it's LE or not. I believe Megasquirt doesn't like LI injectors, there's a way to modify the resistor pack to be able to use high impedance injectors... Then there's Rtek as well... which also has a built in FCD, and is just an add-on chip to the stock ECU. Megasquirt is definitely superior it seems, but requires more work and money. I'd rather not have to pay a professional tuner, rather do it myself or with one of your guy's help, I'm sure it can be done. So there's that...

I originally wanted something around 250whp, but now I guess 300whp seems like a better number to chase, I'm unsure if the stock turbo can handle that. The stock S4 turbo is apparently rebuilt, I can't feel any play. I'll have to check out the waste gate and see if it's ported or not. Should I send out the turbo to BNR and give it the stage 1, 2 or 3...

Current set up would be primary 550cc and secondary 750cc, but is that enough?

Currently I don't have a turbo BAC (or any emissions on the turbo engine to be exact) I'm sure the Megasquirt could run fine without one, but the Rtek?

Anyways, just considering things now, please feel free to add input! Like I said, I'm in no hurry to complete this, but getting things done one at a time, like sending the turbo out, either chipping the ecu or wiring up megasquirt as soon as I can is preferred. Just things I'm currently considering.
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz January 02, 2015, 10:41:48 PM
Happy New Year! So, a little update, nothing crazy just documenting stuff. Anyways, got a decent job finally, on top of school, so there's that... and there goes all that free time I had! More money = more parts though!

So, Megasquirt it is, I've made my mind up finally. Watched a video of Aaron Cake doing an install into a Cosmo, the whole thing isn't that complicated or difficult really. I want to not have to run an Air Flow Meter, that's definitely one of the advantages of the Megasquirt that I want. There are tons more benefits though...

Anyways, took the car out today for a little spin. Everything was working fine, until I turned the lights on in the driveway the car immediately died.

Here she is.
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1600_zps6f89da2a.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1600_zps6f89da2a.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_1599_zps18e5c547.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_1599_zps18e5c547.jpg.html)

Anyways, the engine seems to have good compression, but who knows about the water seals. I don't suspect them to be bad, but who knows. It would really suck to finish the swap only to find out it needs new seals. So, I'm thinking maybe it's a good idea to tear her down and inspect? What would you guys do in this case.

Also, here's a picture of the wastegate, I really can't tell if it's ported or not. The exhaust fins don't look so good either, not sure how much that would affect performance.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/IMG_1817_zps1e233f3d.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/IMG_1817_zps1e233f3d.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/IMG_1814_zps89b3b48a.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/IMG_1814_zps89b3b48a.jpg.html)

Check out these awesome parts! 550 Primaries and 750 Secondaries.
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/IMG_1810_zps4122c901.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/IMG_1810_zps4122c901.jpg.html)
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: toplessFC3Sman January 04, 2015, 11:21:02 AM
That turbo looks like an apex seal has gone through it at some point in the past.  It'll still work, but it will lose some response, efficiency, and probably won't last as long since it won't be as finely balanced.

Its possible to block off, partially fill, & pressurize the coolant passages of the block with an air pump or something.  Then, see if the radiator cap holds the 13 - 16 psi, and whether that pressure bleeds down when you turn off the air pump.  If it holds, you're good; if it bleeds off very quickly, there may be a problem or there may not be... (a lot of flow back thru the pump, or a block-off that's not sealing properly, or the fact that nothing is warm (including the seals) and that air can escape more easily than water/coolant).  It can be a bit of work for a potentially inconclusive test.

You can use a resistor pack with low-impedance injectors to make them act like high-impedance.  This will have an impact on the opening times & amount of flow you can get out of them, but with MS3 instead of MS2, you can time their injections, essentially getting back some of the lost fueling precision.  I'm biased towards MS in general, but it really is a trade-off of capability vs ease-of-use.  There's also a thread in the 2nd gen forum on RX7club about chipping the stock ECU to retain & tweak the OEM calibrations, which would be similar to an Rtek in capability.

Have you checked all the fuses for why the car died?  The headlight thing is odd; maybe check the grounds and clean up the battery posts & terminals?
: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz May 07, 2015, 03:48:28 PM
So, currently I'm having some sort of weird Idle/charging issue. I took her to work a month ago, and everything seemed fine until the drive home. The car stalled on my way home, as I slid into Neutral and came to a complete stop, the car stalled. Went to try and start her back up, and of course she wouldn't start, it was as if the battery didn't have enough cranking power. Had a friend jump start me (as I was in the middle of the road, haha) She started right up! This also happened as I came to a stop in my drive way. Wouldn't start, jump start fixed her. A week later, the battery was completely dead. The whole time the internal stock voltometer has read just a tad over 12V, sometimes dipping below 12V. I have another alternator I will test out, and perhaps another battery.

I believe this issue relates to the incident when the car died due to the headlights turning on. Once it dies, it won't turn back on. All fuses are fine (Engine and kick-panel, are there others that I'm unaware of?) I'll start troubleshooting this when I get the second.

Anyways... So I plan on getting the turbo rebuilt, probably by BNR. Stage 2 or 3?

I need to test the block for good compression and sealing. I'm just thinking about tearing her apart and replacing things anyways, just to start out fresh.

I do plan on getting MS3, this is my next big purchase I will be making. So stay tuned!

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_2109_zpspw2nlwzv.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_2109_zpspw2nlwzv.jpg.html)
Here she is looking pretty! Besides all the issues, she runs (When she runs) really well! I'm very impressed with the lightweight flywheel, and glad I upgraded the 5th and 6th port actuators rather than remove them. It's got great low end torque and quite impressive top end with the street port.





: Re: 1986 GXL engine rebuild
: murz May 07, 2015, 06:29:12 PM
So, I ended up having some spare time after class tonight, and of course did some tinkering around. Threw on the spare alternator I had from a Turbo II S4. And Wallah! No major idle issues yet... No stalling... In fact, the voltmeter was reading 13.5-14 Volts!!!!! With all the accessories on she was probably around 13.5V just from eye-balling it. I will do some more testing sometime this weekend perhaps. I will be converting her over to true manual steering as well if she is drivable(as in can make a 30-40 minute drive without stalling). Oh, she idles kind of high right now, I can lower it (1k is about as low as she wants to go), but i have it a little high just in case she starts to lose power then I have some time to save her. (http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_2362_zps7kfls83p.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_2362_zps7kfls83p.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_2368_zpsvti3lxke.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_2368_zpsvti3lxke.jpg.html)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ~Groll69~ May 07, 2015, 06:44:35 PM
that is great to hear.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: toplessFC3Sman May 11, 2015, 10:30:01 AM
Was your car originally canadian market? It looks that way, with the oil pressure gauge in kg/cm2 vs PSI
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz May 11, 2015, 01:06:46 PM
Yes, she's canadian eh? Also, while the charging issue is fixed. The stalling issue remains, even though it's hard to reproduce. I got it to try and stall when i turned the fan on once. I was testing it for about 30 minutes, putting loads on and off.

Canadian model might have something i'm missing or overlooking?
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: fidelity101 May 11, 2015, 02:16:57 PM
All canadian cars have DRL (day time running lights) although I am not sure how old that requirement is.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz May 11, 2015, 04:02:52 PM
Mine definitely has that disabled if it ever had it. I wouldn't mind that though.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz July 20, 2015, 08:27:52 AM
Replaced the wiring harness, the tps wiring was bad and who knows what else. I was able to compensate for it by messing with the throttle cable. This allowed me to drive. It was running stupid rich, and i spent a lot of time trying to find the culprit. It floods every single time, i installed a fuel cut switch to help, but it's more of a bandaid fix. The flooding is so bad, there is gas mixed with the crank case oil. Oil change is on the list!

Anyways, after much brainstorming i realized i need to change out the tps wiring, as no signal to the tps will cause it to run that rich i've read. My guess is the stalling issue may be related, as i put load on the car, the idle drops, but it only gets richer, causing it to slowly die. Just my theory.

We'll see if it fixes the issue. I can't wait to drive this car properly! Also now i've got a low mileage s-5 Turbo and manifold that look unused even. Figuring out what type of intercooler i want to go with now...
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz August 03, 2015, 08:26:14 AM
Anyone have any good recommendations for an intercooler? There are so many things that go into this build.

Also, think I may have solved a few of the issues with the current NA set up. Still double checking some things. want to know for sure.

I took her out for a spin, and man she's a fun!!! car!!! She may not be the fastest thing on the block (Now that a V8 FD is on my block) but she's so fun! The Throw out bearing is making noises, that's probably because i realized I had an S5 transmission after the fact... and had an S4 TO bearing.

The lightweight flywheel really makes the car a blast to drive. I'm glad I have a lightweight flywheel on the turbo engine already installed.

The exhaust combination is also very nice, WOT is so loud! Much louder than Racing Beat, much more aggressive as well. Addicting! It's much louder at idle though. I'll get a picture of her soon.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL August 03, 2015, 04:09:30 PM
I have always used Greddy FMICs and have had no issues.  I have heard that most of the ebay ones are fine too for a lot less money.  CX racing might be a company to research.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz August 03, 2015, 05:12:57 PM
Greddy seems too expensive, but if I could find one for cheap... either way I think I'll need to drill holes in the body, I don't think I can dodge that.

CX Racing sells http://www.cxracing.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=KIT-FC-FM-IC0016-A-BOV009-FIL-76-155-130-RED&Category_Code=ICKMZD (http://www.cxracing.com/mm5/merchant.mvc?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=KIT-FC-FM-IC0016-A-BOV009-FIL-76-155-130-RED&Category_Code=ICKMZD) Which looks good and sells for a decent price. But I have looked up a lot of reviews on Rx7club, and the kit itself takes a bit of fabrication it seems, more so than advertised. This was my number one pick before I looked into them a while back though, I may end up getting it though.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL August 04, 2015, 12:05:09 AM
That kit actually looks pretty well sorted, you will have to cut holes in the body, at least I did.  I would go for that kit if you like the price.  I did my own piping on my 20b and it was no big deal.  The Greddy piping kit I had on my 86 hit the hood and didn't really fit perfect anyway.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz August 04, 2015, 08:03:08 AM
awesome, yeah I figured as much that there would be no avoiding it really. Here's a current video of the car running. It sounds nice, but I can't seem to get that idle any lower now. But it sounds nice! haha. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xR39z1ES0s&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xR39z1ES0s&feature=youtu.be)

Currently removing the bed liner crap the PO put on the car, it'scoming off slowly with a bit of Goop be gone, and a lot of elbow grease.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz August 20, 2015, 07:00:51 AM
Haven't had much time to work on Silver lately, but I thought I'd do this update, I think my issue is a vacuum leak, even though I've eliminated all but two vacuum lines and replaced them with upgraded silicone lines, I've spray tested all possible locations and couldn't find anything. I completely disregarded it being a vacuum leak because of this. But when I start the car, she revs up to 3k, and goes back down to 1.5k then goes to 1.2k, and as soon as she's warm she goes back to 1.5k. If i turn her off warm, and restart her, she goes to 3k, then goes to 1.5k and stays there.

The fact she revs to 3k each time, even on warm start ups, is telling me that it's probably a vac leak, as the 3k start up should only occur when COLD. Now, the ONLY gasket I haven't replaced is the damn one between the plenum and the Upper Intake. I have a gasket for it and will try to get to that soon, I've sprayed around it without finding leaks, but it's a strange spot to fully spray anyways.

Besides that, I've been working on cleaning up the bay a bit, the PO put this bed liner crap all over the engine bay, and it was poorly done on top of that. I'm talking, the crap was over all the wiring and anything attached to the car. It comes off fairly easy with the plastics, but the metal it self takes a ton of elbow grease and goop-off. Here's just a progress shot from how she looked like a few years ago, til now.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/11_zpsgdcgug5z.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/11_zpsgdcgug5z.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/IMG_0625_zpsq1zgnqor.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/IMG_0625_zpsq1zgnqor.jpg.html)+9


(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/IMG_0644_zpswp4hcqgr.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/IMG_0644_zpswp4hcqgr.jpg.html)

: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz August 20, 2015, 07:27:23 AM
Next big plans while remaining NA: Upgraded Radiator, and Megasquirt! I just need the time, haha. Perhaps a temp controlled E-fan as well.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ~Groll69~ August 20, 2015, 07:37:37 AM
At the rate your going with it, i think your Silver is a mythical being.  It doesn't exist.  lol  If you need a hand with any of it let me know. 
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz August 20, 2015, 07:49:53 AM
Haha, I agree it's been quite a while, but I want to get her perfect on the stock ECU, before I get her perfect on MS, and then and only then will I do the turbo swap, it shouldn't be too bad, as I have most parts already. It'll be a drop in deal sort of, a lot of things to swap out but I shouldn't have to wait for parts, etc.

If this gasket doesn't fix the leak I could use a hand in figuring it out. I'll definitely let you know. "The Mythical Silver GXL"
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ~Groll69~ August 20, 2015, 08:00:19 AM
It seems that GXLs here have a common theme of being the Mythical car!!! lol  I am so glad mine is running now.  The Myth is real folks!!!
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL August 20, 2015, 07:16:53 PM
If the 3k RPM start is controlled by temperature and your engine revs up cold or hot, this tells me your engine thinks it is cold all the time.  Maybe it's a bad coolant temp sensor?  This would make it run rich as well.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: toplessFC3Sman August 20, 2015, 07:40:56 PM
Have you checked both the primary & secondary throttle plate stops vs. where the plates actually hit their bores & sealed?  I had a very persistent high idle and it turned out that the secondary plates' throttle stop (the plate on the throttle shaft) had bent a little & was keeping them from completely closing. This also made the car run more poorly since the fuel was only being injected into the primaries, but half the air was coming from the secondaries, leading to poor fuel distribution
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: fidelity101 August 21, 2015, 07:42:19 AM
  
Have you checked both the primary & secondary throttle plate stops vs. where the plates actually hit their bores & sealed?  I had a very persistent high idle and it turned out that the secondary plates' throttle stop (the plate on the throttle shaft) had bent a little & was keeping them from completely closing. This also made the car run more poorly since the fuel was only being injected into the primaries, but half the air was coming from the secondaries, leading to poor fuel distribution

I think this is going on with my car...
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 14, 2015, 08:04:48 AM
I think this could be it, definitely something to check. Lowest i can get it to idle is 1200, but i think i'll take it off and check it all out again.

Also, slight change of plans... Going to go stock T2 before i go Megasquirt. So, time to aquire some stock t2 junk. Boost sensor, maf, and stock bov piping. Oh and the ecu...
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 15, 2015, 05:52:24 AM
Okay, looks like all i'll need is the AFM and boost sensor. I think this will go quickly. Maybe do the swap before winter.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ~Groll69~ September 15, 2015, 06:19:41 AM
all for that idea.  lets make this happen.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 15, 2015, 07:06:44 AM
How difficult is it swapping the differential? Besides that, everything seems straight forward, i can even use the NA EM harness, not bad! Just some tweaks are needed. I'll stay top mount until it's running right, theb switch to fmic. I think ITSWILL has an afm and boost sensor that i could buy off him.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ~Groll69~ September 15, 2015, 09:05:05 AM
swapping the differential shouldnt be difficult at all.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL September 15, 2015, 02:58:29 PM
Swapping the diff isn't easy but it isn't the worst thing either. Takes a couple hours.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 16, 2015, 07:00:27 PM
Cleaned up the engine and transmission a bit, (http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_0926_zps1x0b43ew.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_0926_zps1x0b43ew.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/IMG_0928_zpsejclndsb.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/IMG_0928_zpsejclndsb.jpg.html)

Not sure if I should paint anything or not, either way it all looks nice. The Turbo is an S5 with an S5 exhaust manifold. Just getting everything set up and ready for when I do the swap.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ~Groll69~ September 17, 2015, 07:16:17 AM
I would say add some paint.  It will make it look even nicer for a longer period of time.  Since it is sitting out, then that is a perferct time to do so. 

OR

You can just give it to me to go into the TII i have now lol.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL September 18, 2015, 12:59:43 AM
Looks clean. Put it in the way it is. That's my vote.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 18, 2015, 08:01:52 AM
A little bit more cleaning, if I paint anything, it will be the housings. Everything is actually quite clean. Just waiting to get a few more parts, then I'll be ready for the swap.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz December 20, 2015, 12:37:31 PM
Definitely taking my sweet time with this project.

I have nearly everything I need for the swap, I just need primary 550cc high impedence injectors, a downpipe, and turbo II axles. I now have everything else I'll need. With school full time, work full time, and a LeMons project, my time is limited right now. I'd like to have this done by August though...

: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz December 20, 2015, 01:10:40 PM
Figured I'd post this here as well. This was my friend's car back in high school ten years ago that got me into RX-7s.

He was finally able to find pictures of it for me. You wouldn't believe it, but this was bought in a junkyard and looked more like a heap of bent metal and rust originally. My friend's dad owns a body shop, which at the time, did all of the work on the car. They did a pretty good job, though it took quite some time. As soon as my friend turned 16, the car was his.

A rebuilt streetported S5 engine was thrown in, with a full racing beat exhaust as well. BMW Sterling Grey was the paint used.

The car was eventually sold for a large profit to someone out west who flew here to drive it home.
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Old%20and%20New/IMG_1213_zpsymlslcsb.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Old%20and%20New/IMG_1213_zpsymlslcsb.jpg.html)
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Old%20and%20New/IMG_1215_zpsk9lqtkzp.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Old%20and%20New/IMG_1215_zpsk9lqtkzp.jpg.html)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: fidelity101 December 27, 2015, 08:01:28 PM
That engine/trans is stupid clean.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz December 28, 2015, 07:54:25 AM
Thanks! Yeah which is why i don't think it needs painted.

So, i found a Turbo II hood for cheap, i now have everything (except real minor things) to make a stock Turbo II.

I'm going to tackle this in stages.

Stage I: convert to stock turbo II, with S5 turbo, and modded NA harness.

Stage II: megasquirt and better turbo, probably BNR something, front mount intercooler, larger injectors, de powered steering rack, and more.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz January 12, 2016, 01:27:36 PM
So, i was thinking the Stock S4 GXL weighs something around 2625lbs, which is pretty darn light compared to the S5s. But, going Turbo is going to add a little bit of weight, so I wanted to make up for that, by removing what I can.

Things that will affect the weight:

Adding a Turbo= +22lbs (this is the S4 variant, the S5 which I'll be using seems a bit lighter and smaller)
Changing from a NA trans to a T2 trans = +19lbs
Changing from 15 inch GXL wheels to 16 inch GTUs rims= +4lbs
Total= +25lbs
------
I'm assuming the Turbo II intake weights the same, if not less than the NA set up. Since the NA has, lower intake, upper intake, and plenum+TB+more of that plastic snorkel tubing.

Going from a 27.8lb T2 Flywheel to a 10lb flywheel w/ 4lb counter weight = -13lbs

A/C Delete = -15lbs, (not sure if this accounts for the cooler and tubes)
P/S Delete = -20lbs (The mounting bracket as well as all P/S associated things)
Airpump Delete= -9lbs
Emissions, ACV, emissions rack, air silencer etc= -15lbs?
Steel hood to T2 Alum hood= -20lbs
Spare tire delete = -28lbs
Jack and winch delete= -2lbs
Total = 122lbs

Which equates to about 2547Lbs
-----------

Now, I want to keep it as daily-driveable as possible, so the sound deadening won't be removed, I like having a passenger seat, etc. I want to pretty much maximize the car's horsepower when it's all set and done. I want her to look like a stock Turbo II as much as I can as well. But I'd like to maximize my power to weight without drilling holes in the car and removing body panels.

There's a few things I didn't take into account, such as the Racing beat/Borla exhaust mix I have going on, as well as the turbo II spoiler, Turbo II axles, and a few other minor things that I have not weighed yet. I'll eventually weigh all the intake stuff as well.

I think 2547lbs is pretty light either way for a car that will have 250bhp (hopefully) initially, and then 300+ down the road.

Anything I'm missing, or suggestions?



: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: fidelity101 January 12, 2016, 03:03:19 PM
I dont think the emissions delete is 15 lbs, maybe 5. not much to it but other than that I think you're on the right track.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL January 14, 2016, 06:56:37 PM
You could delete the rear antenna and use the windshield one.

I will through in my 2 cents about the lightweight flywheel because I have run them on turbo 13Bs and I have one on my 20B.  I personally am not a fan of light weight flywheels on a 13b.  Beside total vehicle mass reduction the performance gains I didn't feel were favorable for a street car.  Yes it seemed to free rev faster but there was no distinguishable feel of increased acceleration. Actually whether it was or not, it actually made the car feel slower especially when changing gears since the light flywheel has less momentum.  Also the car was not as smooth to take off from a stop. 

: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz January 14, 2016, 07:30:36 PM
I totally forgot about the rear antenna, it's not very good anyways. I'll have to do this as well.

As a daily driver I can see the Lighter flywheel being a pain in the ass, I'm running one right now on this car, and I actually really like it, it took a bit of getting used to, I can tell it accelerates faster through 1st and 2nd gear. It does take a bit of finese when starting in 1st, I got used to it quickly though. The revs drop and rise much faster, so shifting can be much faster too. I honestly think it really helps out the NA quite a bit.

The Turbo set up I have, actually came with a lightweight Turbo flywheel, so I'm going to go with that anyways. I'm not sure if it will drop too fast to keep me out of boost, I'll have to make quick shifts to stay in boost if I'm short shifting it I guess.

Totally understand your feelings on the lighter flywheel though, it has its pros and cons.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz May 08, 2016, 07:44:50 AM
Since the vert is out of storage and I freed up garage space, I stored Silver for a bit. While she's stored, the plan is to have the turbo swap done. I now have mostly everything I need, 1 more order of primary injectors, a downpipe and half shafts should do it.
I'll be replacing the hideous front fascia that's been on the car since the PO, with a OEM S4 front. That means the one I have will need to get painted, as well as the T2 hood. It's almost that time! Pretty excited to get this done, I'll have two weeks off of school the end of this month which is when I'll begin the transformation.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/2016/20160507_203132_zpso5cidvoq.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/2016/20160507_203132_zpso5cidvoq.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/2016/20160507_203433_zpsc3bpey5w.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/2016/20160507_203433_zpsc3bpey5w.jpg.html)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL May 09, 2016, 05:37:12 AM
I'm looking forward to seeing this thing on the road, not to mention Turbo Powered!
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz June 03, 2016, 06:26:55 AM
Update, the T2 engine and trans are in. Still a lot left to do, but most of the big stuff is done.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL June 03, 2016, 07:53:45 AM
I really want to come help you but I have to pollish my car for the car show tomorrow. Hope to see the car soon.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz June 06, 2016, 07:52:23 PM
Making progress, may be done this upcoming weekend, can't say for sure.

I have yet to figure out how I'm going to route my crank case lines, and figure out what a few lines do on the Turbo Inlet duct. Pretty much I have to figure out what I will keep and get rid of, I thought I already did this! When you actually get down and assemble it you realize you missed a whole bunch of crap.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/20160606_222339_zpsdcz9hbmm.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/20160606_222339_zpsdcz9hbmm.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/20160606_222120_zpsutlhkchx.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/20160606_222120_zpsutlhkchx.jpg.html)

I've cleaned up the passenger side quite a bit, I still have yet to go through the driver's side and clean up all of the underbody spray the PO decided to use. Also, I re-did all the emissions side wiring and insulation, looks much better!

Old engine I rebuilt 2 years ago.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/20160603_202737_zpsaou1egjf.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/20160603_202737_zpsaou1egjf.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/20160602_205411_zpsygvuc6lm.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/20160602_205411_zpsygvuc6lm.jpg.html)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: Senketsu June 06, 2016, 08:54:56 PM
Can't wait to see her in person! just out of curiosity did you get an RB downpipe to replace your RB header or are you running stock?
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz June 07, 2016, 05:39:03 AM
RB downpipe, of course! Full RB exhaust with Borla Mufflers.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz June 12, 2016, 05:51:03 PM
Making progress!
Right now, all that's left is fluids, throttle body & intercooler, starter wires & transmission wires, and Turbo ECU!

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/20160612_193031_zpsozlqacar.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/20160612_193031_zpsozlqacar.jpg.html)

As I pulled out the old fuel pump to replace it with a Walbro, I inspected my tank, and was able to get all this shit out of it. Not sure what it is. Tank isn't rusty at all.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/20160612_183730_zps2sesmrmj.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/20160612_183730_zps2sesmrmj.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/20160612_185207_zps2ckmaphc.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/20160612_185207_zps2ckmaphc.jpg.html)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz August 08, 2016, 05:53:46 PM
Progress has been really slow, but she's almost ready. Had an issue with the shifter not engaging any gears, turned out some old bearing material had jammed up. I then had an issue with 5th and reverse not engaging, i hammered the selector into gear and that freed it up, i'm guessing the 5th/reverse spring mechanism froze up or something.

All that's left? Add fluids and bleed clutch, then i'll need some tires.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz August 19, 2016, 04:08:29 PM
Got her running last night, after the night before she wouldn't start up. Issues ended up being mainly, the Mass Air Flow Sensor being bad ( I had a spare), and a small fuel leak.

She now has a vacuum leak due to the lower to upper intake gasket snapping in half, even though it was brand new and I'm careful as hell with them it still snapped.

The alternator that's currently on the car when running reads under 10 volts. I need to replace both alternator and gasket.

But!! She has S-4 1987 Turbo 2 wheels, with some nice new tires, a few things changed here and there, including some minor rust, and FINALLY a paint matched front fascia.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/20160818_215534_zps5nxmluyu.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/20160818_215534_zps5nxmluyu.jpg.html)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: Mark.c0000 August 19, 2016, 06:23:41 PM
I'm guessing it's not going to be at Woodward?
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz August 19, 2016, 07:10:19 PM
No, unfortunately, i'm just glad she runs though. I will be there with an Rx7 though!

This car has yet to touch Woodward, when she does she will be perfect.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: fidelity101 August 20, 2016, 10:55:35 AM
I'm glad to see the progress! I may have an extra t2 UIM gasket. LMK
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 01, 2016, 08:22:48 AM
So, the car won't idle on it's own right now, I have the idle set to around 900RPM using the throttle cable method. It works, it actually works fine, I have no flooding issues, no stalling issues, and it starts up faster than my vert does.

I ran into some issues, first I had a fuel leak on the primary injectors, I had swapped out the injectors a few times, ended up being a bad O-ring (new). Also, the feed line going to the primary injectors wasn't tight enough, causing a bit of a seep. This has all been fixed, and no leaks! All 4 injectors are brand new, I was able to find a Honda vendor that sold 550cc and others for about $50 an injector.

Fixed the Lower > upper intake gasket, replaced the alternator, I'm pretty good at taking the upper intake off now, it's much easier than the NA intake.

My Leading coil was dead, which would cause it to fire on just 1 rotor. Weird, as it worked before though. I've never heard what 1 rotor firing sounds like until then.

I re-did a lot of the grounds on the chassis side, to be safe. Also, I'm not entirely sure if the Trailing coil is firing. I'm assuming it is, as I have a working tach.

My coolant sensor was leaking a bit, luckily it just needed to be tightened a bit more. Besides that, the car is leak free now.

Now, the only real issues I have is that my windows don't roll down, I've verified the switch is working, as I cleaned and tested it on my vert. I'm hoping it's just a fuse, no biggie. Also, my car beeps constantly when running, I've confirmed the beeping is related to the Power steering not being detected. I'll figure that one out...

Pictures will come later, and hopefully I will get around to driving it this weekend maybe... maybe...




: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 01, 2016, 04:50:15 PM
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Mobile%20Uploads/20160901_192146_zpsrf2xcltp.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160901_192146_zpsrf2xcltp.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Mobile%20Uploads/20160901_193431_zpsfulhaadg.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160901_193431_zpsfulhaadg.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Mobile%20Uploads/20160831_193913_zpsqfoexxfw.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160831_193913_zpsqfoexxfw.jpg.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Mobile%20Uploads/20160901_192115_zpslaurkbxc.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160901_192115_zpslaurkbxc.jpg.html)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: Senketsu September 02, 2016, 07:00:42 AM
she looks really nice! Gotta fix that idle and take her to Woodward!
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 02, 2016, 07:21:23 AM
Thanks, that's the plan, maybe tonight.

I think the idle issue is due to too much fuel pressure, I'll be needing an aftermarket regulator. That's to come.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: Senketsu September 02, 2016, 07:47:07 AM
Have you checked your plugs? If you're running so rich it's killing your idle they should have developed a pretty thick layer of Carbon on them.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 02, 2016, 07:51:20 AM
haven't checked them yet, but with the aftermarket fuel pump and stock regulator, I can only imagine. It starts up fine though, which is nice.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL September 02, 2016, 07:54:05 AM
A pressure regulator may help, but I highly doubt it is your issue.  I ran 2 cars both with walbro 255s and stock fuel pressure regulators and they started up and idled like a dream. When I had a leaking blow off valve I ran into hard starting and idle issues.

Also you may consider leaving it rich, the reason I suggest that is because I'm not sure the stock ECU will add fuel to compensate for boost much above stock levels.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL September 02, 2016, 08:03:24 AM
Now that I am thinking about boost levels, I remembered that you have a fuel cut defender.  That could be doing something funny to the MAP sensor, or there could be an issue with the MAP sensor itself.  Also where did you connect the vacuum hose at the engine?
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 02, 2016, 09:07:47 AM
I remember you saying you had the stock reg w/ walbro, so it's possible then! I'll check my BOV though, who knows. I have the Boost sensor Teed into the BOV vacuum and they go into the upper intake manifold.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL September 02, 2016, 01:09:01 PM
I doubt its your BOV, that would make it hard to start. Which port on the UIM? They don't all have vacuum all the time.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 02, 2016, 01:41:22 PM
The port next to the BAC, its the only port on the passenger side. I made sure it was a port that sees vacuum
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 07, 2016, 10:03:57 AM
After playing around with the car a bit, I was able to reinforce some of the shoddy wiring on the chassis side. Also, I was doing some thinking and thought maybe my car would run on 1 rotor and just not start if I ran out of gas. Maybe?? My gauge wasn't showing me as empty, but I checked, and I was empty... Great gauge isn't working.

I put about 3 gallons of gas in, and she starts right up! The gauge is showing as about a quarter full now, so I'm hoping it's working. Anyways, I then decide to take her out for a quick drive, just to ensure no problems. She drives very well, especially considering she has a lightweight flywheel, clutches super nice and easy, and the transmission shifts like butter.

Can hear the turbo spool up around 2k RPMs, very pleasant sound. I decide to get into boost to see how she acts after she was warmed up nicely. Didn't quite feel very powerful, but the low end torque is quite surprising for being a 13b. My fuel pump started whinning about this time, extremely loud, loud enough to overpower my idle noise. I was a bit concerned as my car didn't feel like it was making boost, and my fuel pump became extremely loud all of a sudden.

Pulled over, shut the car off, realized my waste gate was disconnected, that explains the boost issues. Started the car back up (she started right back up too) and the fuel pump whine is back.

My best possible explanation is that I'm low enough on gas still that the pump isn't submerged and isn't muffling the whine.

I'm still using the throttle cable as a means for idle, my car seems to idle much better without my NA BAC rigged for a T2, so that's off right now, and blocked off. I'm thinking a T-2 BAC would help me out, as I'd be able to bump up the idle (No emissions) which seems to be a common thing with T2 minus emissions. Though, I'm very happy with how it's running, 900RPM idle, smooth as butter once she's warmed up. No flooding, instant starts.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 09, 2016, 02:16:48 PM
Was able to get a 30 minute drive in today, just putzing around seeing how she behaves. After about 5 minutes of running, the fuel pump begins to start whinning to the point of drowning out the exhaust and the radio on full blast. She won't go into boost right now, as at 3800 RPMs I begin to get hesitations. Which scare me, I can drive with a light foot over 4k rpms, but any WOT and it will hesitate. I know it's not the typical grounding issues, as it works when the fuel pump isn't making noises, and I've re-done them all. Since re-installing the fuel pump I was a bit low on gas, actually I was basically on E after cleaning out the fuel tank. When the fuel pump is whining I get a bit of hesitations all throughout the rev range when more than a quarter throttle. This also doesn't happen when it isn't whining. Here's what I found on this, basically when using a walbro for the first time, you need to have a half tank or more preferably, without doing this, there's a good chance they'll overheat and have several issues. So... new fuel pump I'll have to get.
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Mobile%20Uploads/20160909_150612_zpslnfko3tq.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160909_150612_zpslnfko3tq.jpg.html)
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Mobile%20Uploads/20160909_150640_zpsjyeeflnm.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160909_150640_zpsjyeeflnm.jpg.html)
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Mobile%20Uploads/20160909_144330_zpszvjvoesp.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160909_144330_zpszvjvoesp.jpg.html)(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Mobile%20Uploads/20160903_150003_zpseebkwhbl.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160903_150003_zpseebkwhbl.jpg.html)
(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Mobile%20Uploads/20160909_170105_zps5kyipyfr.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160909_170105_zps5kyipyfr.jpg.html)

: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 20, 2016, 06:39:35 PM
I think I figured out why the pump was getting so damn loud, the in take filter is getting clogged up with what looks like mud. I'm thinking I'll have to drop the tank, and clean the damn thing entirely. I changed out the filter, and took her for a drive again, no whinning noises, at least for about 20 minutes anyways. Also, i realized my secondary injectors weren't actually 750cc, they were around 850cc. I since fixed this and replaced them with proper 750cc. Decided to do a 3/4 throttle pull, or maybe just under, and it pulls very nice throughout the band, and generates quite a bit more torque under 3k. The exhaust also doesn't smell rich at all, which has me worried a bit, I'll have to test the fuel pressure and see what I'm getting.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Mobile%20Uploads/Screenshot_20160920-193211_zpsugd7vnsy.png) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Mobile%20Uploads/Screenshot_20160920-193211_zpsugd7vnsy.png.html)

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/Mobile%20Uploads/20160920_193550_zpsnm6fddtz.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/Mobile%20Uploads/20160920_193550_zpsnm6fddtz.jpg.html)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ~Groll69~ September 21, 2016, 05:59:12 AM
Here I thought that you had gotten the tank cleaned when you pulled all of the stuff out before.  Hopefully you can get it completely clean.  Use an acid to take out any rust too to prevent additional buildup in the future.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz March 17, 2017, 05:15:39 PM
So, figured I'd finally post this, found some free time and I really want to finish up this project (need to drop and clean gas tank.)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5O78mzSVukI (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5O78mzSVukI)


Enjoy!
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL March 23, 2017, 09:37:40 AM
After cleaning the chump tank with acid I would suggest using electrolysis
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz May 17, 2017, 12:02:23 PM
Went a different route... after pulling the tank I realized the tank was quite rusty, rustier than I could tell with gasoline in it. The outside of it was quite rusty, and in one area it was quite weak and felt like I could easily puncture it. I ended up buying a replacement fuel tank from 'That guy Bruce' in Milford, I was surprised at how clean it was, especially considering it was used. It looks factory clean on the inside. I also picked up a rust-free sun-roof as well.

Hopefully soon I can have the car on the road!

My next plans are:
1. Paint the black hood and new sun-roof to match the body.
2. Install a wideband sensor and boost sensor.
3. Quest for more power (this may come much further down the road.) It may come in the form of a V8, a Bridgeport or a hybrid turbo. Only time will tell.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz May 22, 2017, 08:11:36 AM
Well, I've installed the new fuel tank, it wasn't that bad to be honest, another hand would have been nice though. I went to start her and the fuel pump wasn't turning on. I swapped the pump with another walbro I had, and it starts and IDLES on its own. However, it sounds like a weak Bridgeport for some reason.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XswVfCw1itc (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XswVfCw1itc)

My guess is that it's firing on just one rotor, it sound and feels like it. Why though? My guess is that either it's popped for some reason (it ran just fine last time, but the bad fuel maybe?) Or perhaps it has a bad coil or spark plugs for some reason? It has been a while since they've been changed...
Or maybe the ECU is causing issues, I did replace it with a 1.7 Rtek since last running it.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz May 25, 2017, 09:17:34 AM
Culprit turned out to be the RTEK, it's running better now with the stock ECU.

I've put a total of 40 minutes of driving behind the wheel the last two days. I'll post a picture of it not in a driveway soon.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz May 26, 2017, 06:56:26 AM
(http://i.imgur.com/e4PnTgT.jpg)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz May 31, 2017, 01:34:25 PM
Put some more time behind the wheel, managed to fix the super annoying beeping/buzzing which turned out to be the power steering module.

The Waste gate arm kept falling off, preventing me from creating any significant boost, I fixed this by putting a small dab on the wastegate lever, enough to take it off if I need to. In the mean time, I enjoy the power it's making, the turbo really compliments the engine!

I still need a boost gauge and Wideband set-up, I will receive these this week sometime. Also, I've noticed belt squeel over 5k when under boost. I will fix this by finally installing my dual belt pulley system.

(http://i1295.photobucket.com/albums/b627/marcusoo71/turbo%20stuff/rx7%20engine%20bay_zpsi5a278dm.jpg) (http://s1295.photobucket.com/user/marcusoo71/media/turbo%20stuff/rx7%20engine%20bay_zpsi5a278dm.jpg.html)

Forgot to mention, I have the stock cold air intake system on, to help restrict the intake to prevent overboost, etc, until I have a wideband and boost gauge installed.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL June 02, 2017, 03:42:50 PM
I like the stock intake, I can almost guarantee you are making more power than if you had a cone filter off the am like many do.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz June 02, 2017, 08:53:21 PM
I saw a dyno comparision of the stock intake with kn filter vs. Cone intake. The cone made more power and boost, but way higher intake temps. I want to make a cold air wall around it and somehow bring in outside air.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL June 03, 2017, 05:09:26 AM
I would like to see that dyno comparison if you still have it.  I didnt think the stock intake was very restrictive.

You could always put your filter like I have mine on the ls1 car.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz June 03, 2017, 06:44:38 AM
I'll find it for you, it was a more recent post on rx7club. What you have is what i would like to do.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz July 02, 2017, 06:35:10 PM
This weekend was productive, I was able to swap out the broken Wiper link-age for the replacement ITSWILL was able to give me (thanks again). While I was there, I completely cleaned out the area between the firewall, re did the seals between the window and vents and re-painted the wiper arms themselves. I also re-did some vacuum lines under the hood, re-adjusted the intercooler as there was a massive leak. I also messed with the throttle body to the point it now idles on its own instead of using the throttle to hold it open. I was very happy about all this.

(http://i.imgur.com/BagVotV.jpg)

I also replaced the rear wing with a better conditioned one I had.

(http://i.imgur.com/ejhrxE6.jpg)

I ended up taking the car for a spin Saturday, considering it was running so well. The boost was instant and full WOT made the car feel fast. which has been the norm lately, but to ensure at the time everything was running fine.

I was at a red light, as soon as the light turned green I opened it up and tried to see how fast I could go until the overpass. As soon as I began approaching the redline in 3rd gear, I was under the overpass, and as I exited it, I let off the throttle. As soon as I did this, there was a massive explosion behind me, sound being so extreme due to the overpass. But the back-fire was a bit different. I shifted into 4th and slowed the hell down. I noticed it didn't have enough power to accelerate anymore. I was worried and expected the worse, I pulled off to the side into a massive parking lot. I was now in 2nd gear, having difficulty accelerating at all. I was able to rev in neutral no problem though. Eventually the engine shutoff. At this point you could imagine I was a bit worried. Car wouldn't restart. I opened the hood, and what do you know, the damn Intake pipe from the turbo to the intercooler busted off. Threw it back on, and we were gold, car started right up. Car had all power restored and all was well, for the time... I took pictures of where it rested at for the minute it was there. (This is also double-clamped now.)

(http://i.imgur.com/5ZKDqCq.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/xDSNtCw.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/5s2l6Bg.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/cv5Ll5p.jpg)

On the drive home, I noticed the coolant gauge slowly rising, I wasn't too worried as I was a minute or two from home, and it wasn't even half way. I decided to take the back way home, as to see if it would continue rising. Well, by the time I got home, the gauge was half-way there. I quickly shut off the car, and sprayed cold water on the radiator, not that it would really do much.

I found this odd, so the next day I checked to make sure the fan wasn't getting stuck or anything, which it wasn't. The belt was fine, maybe a bit tight. I checked the coolant level, and it was a bit low, maybe two cups low, which wasn't too much of a worry. I filled it back up, and noticed the over-flow was a bit low too. I returned to the car about an hour later, (mind you, the car did not run this day) and checked the coolant again. The coolant was at normal levels, however it was colored like chocolate milk and had an oily consistency and smell. This worried me, as I had not started the car since the day before. I then checked the oil as well, and it was the exact same thing, chocolate milk colored, and over-filled.

My car does not smoke, and never has, and I do pre-mix a bit. Doesn't even smoke on start up. The only thing I can think of, is that an outer coolant seal broke inside the oil pan, OR a freeze plug bursted in the front-cover. Both of these scenarios are very rare though. OR I have my coolant and oil lines mixed up, I double checked this and I'm good. I think it might be a good idea to replace the coolant and oil and see if I can re-create it. If this is the case, I'll have to pull the engine again. At least I got to drive it for over a week this year, I'll take it.

Or, is there a chance that something got fked up when the intercooler pipe blew off? I can't really think of anything off the top of my head though...

http://imgur.com/a/y4Q0g (http://imgur.com/a/y4Q0g)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz July 03, 2017, 06:33:59 AM
Well, I will replace fluids and see if this continues. If it does, it will be pulled. If I'm pulling it, it's getting a port job (It may even already have one.), studded, and I'm throwing in the S5 T2 rotating assembling I have. So there's a positive side to this.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ~Groll69~ July 05, 2017, 12:16:31 PM
I really hope that it is nothing major.  Either way it doesn't sound good and I would recommend pulling the motor instead of replace fluids,  it will happen again and root cause needs to be fixed.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz July 05, 2017, 12:27:41 PM
Yep, I decided to not even bother with replacing fluids. Going to get straight to pulling it.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz July 10, 2017, 06:52:46 AM
Engine is out, fluids are out. Sometime this week I'll do damage assessment. Came out with no issues.

(http://i.imgur.com/FLnL8gp.jpg)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: fidelity101 July 11, 2017, 12:57:55 PM
oh no!!!

should be salvageable though its not water rusting in there for years and years from sitting.

I have the pineapple racing coolant system tester if you wanna findout where the leak is.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL August 10, 2017, 06:40:33 PM
Whats the diagnosis?
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 17, 2017, 01:46:38 PM
Diagnosis is in, I thought it was a coolant seal, but nope.

(https://i.imgur.com/ww7cyN8.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/LjiYz0E.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/zI7qvPh.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/HHcHuss.jpg)

Sounds like this is extremely rare!

Also, it's nice to have an actual home and garage now.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: toplessFC3Sman September 18, 2017, 01:53:18 PM
Wow, that is very rare - it just rusted through right in that one spot? Quite strange.

Glad it wasn't anything more serious. So... you found the hole, then you said "fuck it, I've come this far so I'm taking the whole sucker apart anyway"?
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 18, 2017, 07:32:25 PM
I wanted to check bearings for any damage, which both stat gears have considerable amount of wear. Rotor bearings are fine. But yeah pretty much haha.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: fidelity101 September 20, 2017, 06:47:37 AM
I can't tell from the photos very well but the rear iron looks to be in great shape! how are the other irons and housings?
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 20, 2017, 07:16:44 AM
Irons and housings are fine, one housing has a bit of edge wear, but it's near the exhaust, so it should be fine. Irons were in really great shape. All coolant seals were fine, the outer ones seem re-useable, but I'd rather just replace them all. Apex seals (3-piece) seemed fine, I didn't measure them out yet, but I've got some super low mileage 2 piece seals I'll throw in there anyways. Side seals and springs looked fine as well. Rotor bearings and gears are fine as well.

The only pieces that were worn were the stationary gears, there's a bit of copper showing. Also the E-shaft has a questionable area, but it might just be part of the initial factory weld, I'll have to compare with a few other E-shafts I have.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: fidelity101 September 20, 2017, 09:21:56 AM
yeah sounds like its time to grab some s5 stat gears and a new o-ring kit and call it a day.

don't want to give it a streetport while its opened up?
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 20, 2017, 09:24:51 AM
I've got S5 stat gears too! Yeah, I think I do want a bit of a port job... I like stock port, but this car has big plans.
: Re: Murz' 1986 *Always Changing* Arctic Silver GXL Project car
: murz March 16, 2018, 06:22:46 AM
So, after much brainstorming, the plans for this car have changed once again. The initial plan was to re-build the engine throw on the stock T2 parts and eventually go with a hybrid BNR turbo.

Having the FD and its turbocharged rotary goodness, made me re-evaluate this car's destiny again. I've always said you need a fun running car and a fun project car, it can't be both for maintaining sanity(for me at least.) 

The T2 was fun while it lasted, but I think it's time to go back to being Naturally aspirated.

The Plan:

4 Port Turbo engine will be rebuild with a bridge port. Replace S4 gears with S5 gears.
- Half bridge or Full bridge?
- Utilizing stock Turbo rotors (these should utilize more power in the upper RPM range)
- Utilize the Turbo 2 intake, to get things running then go ITB!
- Create a custom exhaust, with long primaries (I'll utilize a RB header in the meantime).
- Megasquirt or some other aftermarket ECU. Carb'd??

-Dyno the thing and hopefully make over 250whp.
-When it gets to become not fast enough, throw on an EFR type turbo.

What do you guys think?

Will's project we're working on, Widman's bridge ported FC and the Anniversary Racing site helped inspire this.

https://translate.google.com/translate?depth=1&hl=en&prev=search&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=ja&sp=nmt4&u=http://a-rf.com/Shop/ChassiDynamo/ranking/rotory_na/index.html (https://translate.google.com/translate?depth=1&hl=en&prev=search&rurl=translate.google.com&sl=ja&sp=nmt4&u=http://a-rf.com/Shop/ChassiDynamo/ranking/rotory_na/index.html)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL March 16, 2018, 02:49:12 PM
So I assume the FC will be the project car.

I wouldn't mess with an NA 13b if that's the case ( I know that's exactly what I'm doing  but I'm mostly doing it to be cheap and have fun).

I would go all out right away, either turbo bridge port or an engine swap.



: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz March 19, 2018, 05:38:05 AM
That's sort of the point with my car as well, I can't really afford to go all out with it off the bat. I want the tuning experience as well of wiring it all up with a standalone ECU. Plus, I'd rather experiment with an NA rotary than a Turbo rotary.

The turbo will be the 2nd phase, I'd love to have this car at least running somewhat before Winter, so I can start building up stuff over the winter.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz March 19, 2018, 06:15:50 AM
Yesterday I was able to bring my old 6 port engine I rebuilt over to my house from the old place. I plan to take it apart and re-use the seals, and while I'm at it, might as well even re-use the housings too.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL March 19, 2018, 07:05:04 AM
Makes, sense. Sometimes it's better to have it up and running than just sitting around.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz June 11, 2019, 01:55:54 PM
What a ride this car has been. It's been two years since it's last ran, in this time the car hasn't seen any attention as it's been sitting in my mom's garage. Finishing school, getting a much more demanding job, buying a house, oh and buying an FD, may have been to blame (Mainly the FD part) for its lack of attention.

A week or two ago, I finally pushed the car out of the garage for the first time in two years, washed the car down, then later that night, ordered everything i'd need to rebuild the engine. The car is going to go back together as it was two years ago, however i might get fancy and add a small to medium street port. A converted P/S rack is going in (thanks to ITSWILL for selling me it) so I can finally experience a true manual steering rack.

All the engine parts have been cleaned up nicely, and awaiting for final assembly and or paint (irons and housings). I've replaced the faulty freeze plug, and will replace all of them as well for extra insurance (some had a bit of pitting going on).

Right now, all that's left to do is to figure out what I want to do with the ECU, it will run on the stock ECU at first, but immediately I need to go with something else that can handle higher boost levels. Currently thinking of getting another PFC, or go the easier route and go with an adaptronic and learn to tune it a bit on my own, there's also haltech too. Funds are obviously a concern, hence why I'm leaning towards the adaptronic plug and play unit.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL June 11, 2019, 05:58:14 PM
megasquirt
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: toplessFC3Sman June 12, 2019, 07:18:30 PM
Definitely start with the OEM ECU, that way you aren't getting into unknown territory (stand-alone) while also trying to debug other problems. Its much, much easier if you know you're starting with a fully functioning engine, wiring harness, sensors, injectors, spark system etc than trying to troubleshoot everything electrical at once.

I'm also a big fan of the megasquirt, especially for the DIY learning, but Kevin has certainly had issues with his which I'm sure you're aware of. If you want to learn (or at least aren't afraid of learning) how the electronic & controls side of the car works, I'd highly recommend the megasquirt, but it's not quite a plug-and-play sort of system. As an oddball option, there was also an effort on the RX7club to pull the processor off of the OEM ECU and replace it with a set of headers and flashable chip so that you can essentially be tuning the OEM ECU with all the control loops and whatnot that are already in place. The biggest downside there is the likely lack of support if things don't go well since its just a small group of people doing it, and the limitations as far as speed, table size, memory etc that go along with a chip designed in the 80s. Plus, for going NA to Turbo, you'd need to read up on it a little bit to see if you can scale the tables and change the limits for them, as well as use a bigger MAF or replace the MAF with just the MAP sensor altogether, etc.

Good job replacing all the freeze plugs - I had one pop out on me when I was back visiting my parents in NJ a number of years back, and of course it was one of the ones right behind the flywheel...
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL June 13, 2019, 04:58:08 AM
I ran an Rtek for a while without issue. unfortunately they aren't supported any longer.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz June 13, 2019, 05:57:33 AM
I've always wanted to do Megasquirt, and might even still later down the road. Right now, MS is pretty intimidating and far from plug and play. I have a stock S4 ECU that's on the car now, and has ran just fine two years ago, I had a 1.7 RTEK unit too, but that never worked right, my guess is something was wrong with the board thinking about it now?

Since RTEK is gone, buying a used one can be pricey now, as compared to what they went for previous to the company announcing their discontinuation. Though, if I come across one of the later models for a good price i'd probably go for that.

This is why i'm partial to the adaptronic, it's plug and play, you tell it your car's basic parameters (AFR targets, timing, rev-limiter, overboost, Fuel inj size, etc.) and it sort of sets it self up with a base map. And further tuning it from there would be less daunting if the base map is good to go.

For now I'll use my stock ECU and come up with a decision, though if anyone is selling a Fuel Cut Defender, let me know.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL June 13, 2019, 11:18:57 AM
I would not use a fuel cut defender. They just trick your ecu into thinking it is only making factory boost. Therefore it doesnt make any fueling or ignition corrections.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz June 13, 2019, 12:19:09 PM
It would be used only until a new ECU is installed. I'm well aware the stock S4 Turbo ECU cuts fuel to the rear rotor around 7PSI, having a free flowing exhaust, 7PSI should be pretty easy to hit, and i'm well aware as much of a precaution that is, it's also very easy to go lean with that. Also, having 720 secondaries, and a 255 walbro should provide more fuel up top anyways.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL June 13, 2019, 03:09:52 PM
It's not just the fuel that is the issue it's the ignition timing that is the bigger problem.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz July 01, 2019, 11:57:19 AM
Engine is assembled, now just to throw it in the car and get it running! I have a four day weekend to get it all done, hoping to have it running by Sunday!

People seem to have no problem running an RTek, or hell even the stock ECU with a FCD, and an exhaust without the timing needing to be changed. Of course, being able to adjust the timing needed for really tuning the car. Which is why I'll be going with an after market ECU once I get the car running and broken in, I'm going to break it in on the stock ECU before I start playing with the boost and tune.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: fidelity101 July 08, 2019, 09:14:22 AM
  
I've always wanted to do Megasquirt, and might even still later down the road. Right now, MS is pretty intimidating and far from plug and play. I have a stock S4 ECU that's on the car now, and has ran just fine two years ago, I had a 1.7 RTEK unit too, but that never worked right, my guess is something was wrong with the board thinking about it now?

Since RTEK is gone, buying a used one can be pricey now, as compared to what they went for previous to the company announcing their discontinuation. Though, if I come across one of the later models for a good price i'd probably go for that.

This is why i'm partial to the adaptronic, it's plug and play, you tell it your car's basic parameters (AFR targets, timing, rev-limiter, overboost, Fuel inj size, etc.) and it sort of sets it self up with a base map. And further tuning it from there would be less daunting if the base map is good to go.

For now I'll use my stock ECU and come up with a decision, though if anyone is selling a Fuel Cut Defender, let me know.

When i tried your RTEK it always wanted to cycle the fuel pump relay and was not functioning very well at all. I think that one is junk :(

go standalone!!!
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz July 08, 2019, 10:15:41 AM
yeah I had issues with it not wanting to start, I assumed it was due to other reasons, but then you told me you had issues too.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz July 09, 2019, 05:09:22 AM
Well, last night I got the car running, but not without issues. First issue, went to prime everything, then noticed a good fuel leak, one of the clamps wasn't tightened enough (the one just below the filter). Then the battery died after about 3 more starts, I was using the vert's battery which has been sitting on a trickle charger since September. I was able to get my FC's battery from Ishin (I lent him it to do some testing about two years ago).

Then the car just wouldn't start. I went through the throttle body settings, and tried to set it back to factory, or as well as I could (I had it all messed up from the previous engine.)

Then, it started, the car is so quiet, I watched the revs climb, but I expected it to be louder, so it was almost surreal. It smoked the neighborhood for about 2 minutes, then cleared up. I let it sit at 2k for a bit with my foot, then i let off the gas and tried to see if it would idle on its own. To my surprise, it did! It was idling at around 600rpm, so i bumped it up with the BAC valve's idle adjustment screw to around 800-900rpm. Checked for leaks again, then decided to take it for a spin.

The Exedy stage 1 HD clutch and the lightweight flywheel really help the car out down low, it's got pretty good low end, it's actually quite surprising. The turbo starts spooling pretty early, and you can hear it spooling by 1700 rpms it seems. The idle is a bit lumpy, and has a definite brap to it, though nothing compared to Jake's FC, but more lumpy than my FD's idle and previous engine setups. Coming to a stop, the dashpot is doing its job by settling the idle to around 1100rpm, then a few seconds later it slowly drops down to 800-900rpms (I had a problem with this before).

Right now the only problem is that it's difficult to start without using the fuel cut switch I have. From what I've read, this should be the case as my setup has the stock fuel pressure regulator, plus a walbro 255lph pump. This shouldn't be an issue once I change over to a parallel fuel system. I don't have a gauge, but from what people have seen, this setup usually runs at 55lbs of pressure! Stock, i believe is around 27lbs?

: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: FCwidman July 09, 2019, 03:41:47 PM
Congrats, Can't wait to finally get the 2 silver cars cruising woodward together!
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ITSWILL July 10, 2019, 07:02:25 PM
I never had an issue using a walbro and the stock regulator. It ran a slight bit rich but fired up immediately on the coldest day of the winter or hottest day of summer. might be worth figuring out what your fuel pressure actually is.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz July 11, 2019, 04:33:51 AM
I read up online about it, a lot of people on the club have had hot start issues with the walbro and stock regulator. My car starts up just fine cold, but hot, i have to crack the throttle plates just a bit for it to do anything. I've got an aftermarket regulator coming in soon, going to do a parallel setup. I noticed too if i let a little unmetered air in, it idles a bit better.

Besides that, one of the rear brake pads disintegrated and locked up on me last night, going to do brakes and rotors all around.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: toplessFC3Sman July 11, 2019, 06:14:26 AM
My experience with the Walbro 255 and OEM regulator was that basically, the pump was completely maxing out the OEM regulator. There was no variation in fuel pressure with boost, it was just constantly at around 50 - 55 psi. This is definitely undesirable since not only is it working the pump harder, but the whole point of regulating the fuel pressure down as the MAP drops is to get more "range" out of the injectors and allow them to act more consistently.

The ECU knows nothing about the fuel pressure, it just assumes a certain amount of fuel injected for a certain duration of injector pulse - which for our purposes is basically true as long as the FPR is doing its job and keeping a constant difference in pressure across the injector (we're going to ignore injector needle dynamics, effects of pressure waves in the fuel rail, etc here since these are all secondary effects). Basically, for a 1ms injection time, if the pressure difference is 25 psi (so MAP when cruising is 10 psi and fuel pressure is 35, or MAP at idle is 3 psi and fuel pressure is 28 psi), the amount of fuel injected is the same. Therefore, if the walbro pushes fuel pressure up to an almost constant 55 psi, the differences at WOT in boost are going to be fairly small since the fuel pressure would have ordinarily been 48ish PSI for a MAP of 23 PSI (~8 psi boost above atmospheric), but the differences at idle and very low throttle openings are going to be large, meaning that you're getting a lot more fuel under these conditions than the ECU thinks its delivering. Since starting, idle, and low-throttle at low engine speeds are the most sensitive places for a rotary to run due to high amounts of EGR making combustion less stable (especially a ported rotary), you're going to notice more instability, hunting, and un-evenness here. Adding extra un-metered air that the ECU doesn't know about and thus doesn't correct for will help since it will balance out the extra fuel that the ECU doesn't know its injecting, making things more stable.

Basically, this is a long-winded way of saying "get your FPR working and the problem will fix itself".

: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz July 11, 2019, 07:07:39 AM
Thanks for the detailed explanation Pete! I'm surprised the car even idled at all really, i'm certain a new fuel setup will correct it. The current idle is pretty rough (it sounds good though!), but as the car warms up, it does smooth out a bit. In fact, after testing the car out last night, I noticed on cold start, it idles at ~750rpm, but once reaching operating temperature it idles at 900rpm decently smoother. This was another hint that it's just way too rich. 

I've got a turbo smart FPR and the necessary connectors, and lines en route!

The new setup will look like this.

http://www.fc3spro.com/TECH/MODS/FUEL/pararail.jpg (http://www.fc3spro.com/TECH/MODS/FUEL/pararail.jpg)

I've also ordered an adaptronic, as well as a sensor to read fuel pressure, a fast acting air temperature sensor, and an integrated wideband.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz August 02, 2019, 06:04:17 AM
-New Fuel Pressure Regulator installed.
In order to set this up, I needed to convert to a parallel fuel system, which required AN lines and several fittings. It was actually super easy, considering the S4 fuel rails have removable end pieces. However I totally messed up, when I went to test the fuel system (key on, plus opening the MAF flapper door) fuel shot out everywhere. Apparently you need the male to male fittings with the O-ring on one side. Initially the fuel pressure was set to 15PSI, so the car would start, then die. It now idles at 31PSI (stock is supposed to be 29PSI). It starts up like it should now, even hot starts are a breeze! No need to use the fuel cut switch I have, that can now be hidden for security purposes. Also, I installed a boost gauge too.

-New Oil cooler installed.
The old oil cooler sprung a tiny leak at the upper inlet, the new one needed to be re-tapped pretty bad, I was about to send it back in, but I was able to make it work and keep a lot of aluminum shavings out of it. While this was done, its first oil change was performed, considering it needed it from break in already.

-Rear brakes replaced and bled.
Apparently not good enough though, as I took the car out for a spin last night, the fronts aren't doing as much work as they should be. So time to re-bleed again.

-Things I noticed and need work still.
The alternator spacer was placed in the wrong spot, so the alternator pulley was severely misaligned, somehow I did not notice this. Getting a coolant leak from the water pump filler neck area, seems to be either the cap itself or the plastic neck where the cap screws onto.

I got into boost for the first time yesterday, while staying under 3.5k it definitely moves. Also, has wayyyyyy more low end than the FD does (considering the FD is running non-sequential). Guessing the small turbo, small intake piping, 10lb flywheel all play a part into that. It's a lot of fun, I can't wait to drive it some more, too bad I won't have time to bleed the brakes until next week.

The Adaptronic ECU came in as well, before that goes on, it needs to be broken in a bit more.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz August 04, 2019, 06:27:27 PM
Replaced the coolant cap, now it seems the water pump is starting to leak from the leak hole. I can never catch a break on this car it sure seems. Anyways, here is a video of it running. https://youtu.be/7akUjLji1RU
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: ~Groll69~ August 06, 2019, 08:01:40 AM
So glad to see you have it up and running. 
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 24, 2019, 11:30:14 AM
I've put a few hundred miles on it and am now allowing it to get into boost and rev up to 6.5k.

-Ended up having a gasket fail between the water pump housing and block, this caused a small enough leak, and was very difficult to track! This has been corrected, and doesn't leak anymore.

-Car is extremely quiet, even at WOT, i'm not sure if i really enjoy this or secretly hate it. Because of this, i wanted things to make noise, so I moved back to the hot air cone filter intake system, and added a cheap $15 blow off valve to the mix (which replaced. Now, you hear turbo spool noises and a little bit of blow off valve noises. Because of this, I had to reroute the BAC valve hose from the old charge pipe after the turbo, instead into the unused pipe at the intercooler, car idles still! (I had tested it without the BAC, and it would not idle until full operating temperature.)

-Max boost car seems to hit is 7lbs, it hits this somewhere between 2500RPM and 3000RPM and holds it til I let off. It's got a very broad powerband, which is what I was hoping for.

-Just going to drive and enjoy the car finally, it's been 7 years since it's been driven this much.

: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 25, 2019, 05:12:14 AM
(https://i.imgur.com/vFBtUNT.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/uzcCmtr.jpg)

(https://i.imgur.com/NTmOviP.jpg)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 26, 2019, 05:50:49 AM
More photos of the build.
(https://i.imgur.com/KHG6rcE.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/4dHSdWv.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/0wTbrax.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/yBRyYWP.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/z6Zsvfo.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/CCSVm34.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/084SyjP.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/zSHmshO.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/sQHhxQf.jpg)
(https://i.imgur.com/nYPZ2Fl.jpg)

And a video of it running!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6uDA2BvsgQ (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6uDA2BvsgQ)
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: toplessFC3Sman September 26, 2019, 06:32:32 AM
I scrolled down and saw disassembled engine pictures after your triumphant "I'm driving her a lot" posts and thought something had gone terribly wrong!

Glad everything is running well - the stock turbo is definitely quite responsive (although not quite to FD levels I imagine). Having the BAC coming off the intercooler is fine, its still pre-throttle so has ambient air pressure. Do you still have a cat in the system? I'm surprised its that quiet, mine got very loud with just removing the cat with the RB catback
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz September 26, 2019, 07:03:25 AM
No cat, instead i've got a RB presilencer, it's a Borla catback and a 2.5in RB downpipe. Yeah it's very quiet, it loudens up a bit under WOT, but it's still not loud like it was when it was NA, or even compared to the FD. I can't hear it idling under the sound of traffic at all, instinctively i went to "turn up the volume" one time so i could hear it, but realized things don't work like that.
: Re: Murz' 1986 Arctic Silver GXL aka Silver
: murz May 04, 2022, 05:09:59 AM
Just a small update, car has been good to me these past few years, though i'll admit it doesn't get driven as much as the FD does. Wheels and tires, and suspension is next!