Michigan Rotary Club
Technical and Performance => Engine Management Forum => : ~Groll69~ September 14, 2010, 11:28:51 AM
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What improvements can i do with a 13B NA to gain more horsepower from it. I am debating about running a supercharger on it, our trying to find some other simple way to improve the horsepower output. Most of the rats nest is gone and i am lacking the vaccum to my secondary ports to open them properly. I don't want to go crazy with it, but i do want to just give it more get up and go fun. Any ideas or suggestions?
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A turbo, or even better a turbo engine swap.
Its really not that expensive, and a turbo engine swap could probably be done for less than a supercharger kit.
As fun as a NA rotary can be, they are damn slow.
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I would need a good turbo engine and transmision to swap in along with and ecu. I don't have that just laying around. I am just trying to get the most out of my NA.
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Porting is the only way to see a significant power increase from a na. I don't know what you have just lying around but my guess is it doesnt include a header back exhaust system, porting templates, and a rebuild kit. The turbo swap is the cheapest and easiest way to see a noticeable power increase.
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a simple way to get a lil more power is to get the 5th and 6th ports working and sleeve them. pineapple racing makes sleeve inserts and you'll get a little power gain from it
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NOS the rotarys handel juice well a 75 dry will give you good power but its not streetable.
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Why wouldn't it be streetable? Because it is a dry shot? I would surely do a wet shot. Rotaries really don't like going lean.
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1. Get those 5th/6th ports working again. That will make a substantial difference in low end torque.
2. Header and free flowing exhaust system.
3. Ignition system upgrade.
Drive that until it blows up, then replace it with a TII motor. :)
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How can i get the 5th and 6th ports working again? i don't have a connection on my exhuast for back pressure to activate them? Is there another way to rig them to open when secondaries kick in?
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Im sure there is a clever way to operate them via the use of a solenoid actuated by a signal from the secondary injectors.
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Rich ive got an rpm activated switch that I was using on my na auxiliary ports. Worked awesome plus its msd ooooooooo: )
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sounds like something that i definitly need.
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Can i get that off of you to install on my car?
Rich ive got an rpm activated switch that I was using on my na auxiliary ports. Worked awesome plus its msd ooooooooo: )
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Ya. I just need to find it for you.
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thanks. Let me know when you find it
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e85 or nitmeth, huge carbs with gaping ports, lapped, shot peened, and polished internals, rx8 rotating assembly thats been balanced, zero split timing, and a hamster.
why have engine management if all you need is a screw driver???
then you can bash on you car the whole track day while the turbo cars sit and wait for their cars to cool down or fuel trims to adjusted.
a wide band and a screwdriver is the best way.
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E85 isn't gonna do you any good unless you're taking advantage of its greater resistance to knock, which an NA 13B can't do since it doesn't have the compression ratio or the boost. Nothing wrong with a carb'ed setup or anything else you've suggested, although a megasquirt and the stock injection system, once tuned, would perform much more consistently, and would beat the carb in efficiency & power, since none of the 13B carb manifolds I've seen take advantage of the intake wave dynamics that the stock manifold does to cram a little more air in the engine. Not to mention, it could cost a little to a lot less than a carb setup & manifold if you assemble the MS yourself and go with an MS2/V3 setup.
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Here is a dyno cart of a car with reliability modes, a apexi power FC ECU and a good tune.
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http://www.tigerjapanese.com/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=shop.flypage&product_id=331&category_id=9&manufacturer_id=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=26
i have everything else you would need under the hood to get it running.
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The time/cost to rebuild a Tiger engine is a waste. Best way to get power out of an N/A is to get it (or a local motor) rebuilt by a pro. Get all your gap clearance issues taken care of, port, polish, new seals, header+exhaust, good coils/plugs, and some fresh air for the intake. Sleeves are a good idea.
And #1 is a proper ecu/tune.
(I bought a tiger 13b-rew years ago and it was shit, sent it to Mazmart to get rebuilt, it was pushing over 460hp after)
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Recently I went to the dyno, was only able to get it to 6500, 4th gear pulls take FOREVER when you need to get to 8000 rpm, heat was becoming an issue. First time ever on the dyno was I was a bit nervous, I buckled my seatbelt up lol.
(http://img252.imageshack.us/img252/7308/dynoq.jpg)
(http://img848.imageshack.us/img848/2580/slips.jpg)
drag times I pretty much predicted, but I was a little disappointed on the dyno pulls. I know this car is gutted to hell but it can't weight 2000 lbs
I was car 272 in the left lane each run. I'm missing a slip but its basically the same as the other 4.
S5 streetport 6 port with small side draft carb relatively untuned, stock 13b dizzy ignition setup.
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I don't know much about the earlier versions, but the -REW RX-8 motor is notoriously hard to improve on. A good, stock fresh Renny will pull around 185 rwhp. Eric Meyer's full road racing engines pull around 215 with every trick in the book thrown at them. By contrast, a relatively small turbo will add 100 hp for less cost and better driveability. Get what you got running properly first - no power mod works well on a motor that already has problems. Nitrous seems to work well and runs ~$500. Otherwise, ~$5k for a good turbo installation or ~$7k for supercharging.
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Racing beat gets around 3ish for full road race engines.
I know 200 is fairly obtainable with porting and support mods. Also premix with idemitsu or royal purple. Run a royal purple or idemitsu oil engine oil. I've seen proven results(dyno sheets)of gains that can be made with premix and the correct weight, of good quality oil. Jim at racingbeat is more than happy to back this up and give more advice. Also Scott at rx8performance.com got around 241 WHP out of a renesis running on 87 octane. Again I've seen it. Proven results. More power on 87 with the correct tune.